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#1 sociopath

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Posted 07 May 2012 - 03:26 PM

I guess it's not a bad thing - afterall the techies need to keep their knowledge current....

From the ACMA

The ACMA has amended the regulatory requirements for cabling providers who install specialised cabling within customer premises.

The ACMA's Cabling Provider Rules (CPRs) regulate the performance of cabling work in customer premises. Under the CPRs, cabling providers must be registered by registrars appointed by the ACMA. Cabling providers must meet certain competencies set by the ACMA in order to be registered. The ACMA's competencies form the basis for training programs developed by industry skills councils (ISCs).

The amendments to the ACMA cabling arrangements have been made to ensure cabling providers have the necessary skills required to perform specialised cabling work for the current and emerging customer cabling environment.

Under the new arrangement, cabling providers undertaking broadband structured, optical-fibre or co-axial cabling work must have the training competencies relevant to the specialised cabling work. The new competencies only apply to cabling providers who are undertaking the relevant specialised cabling work within customer premises.

As a result of the recent amendments, the cabling ISCs will ensure that training offered by Recognised Training Organisations will include the additional competencies. The new competencies will be reflected in a revised Industry Pathways document to be published on the ACMA website.

The new competency requirements will apply from 1 July 2012. Existing cabling providers who install those specialised cables, but who have not already attained the additional competencies, will be given a 2 year transition period to attain those competencies.


What does this mean? It means any registered cabler will need to go back to school (RTO) and complete another unit or two, in order for them to maintain their registration and endorsements. Helpfully </sarcasm> the ACMA have not yet announced what specific study/assessment will be required.
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#2 Khirareq

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Posted 07 May 2012 - 03:36 PM

Hang on - What is classed as "specialised cabling" first? I note the article does specify Broadband structured, optical fibre, and co-axial - Seems to be all network specific stuff, so I assume that this is being put into place now to prepare cablers for the impending NBN, and this is an early strike trying to implement protections to prevent dodgy people from scamming once the roll-out starts happening (And try to prevent another Home Insulation debacle)

Edited by Khirareq, 07 May 2012 - 03:37 PM.

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#3 Mordenakhnen

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Posted 07 May 2012 - 06:03 PM

If I remember correctly (probably a first), when I got my ACMA open registration a few years ago, it was legal to do any telecomms cabling including data without the relevant endorsements (structured, optical, coax) as long as you had the open registration. The endorsements mainly being of use to get a job with a company that did the relevant work, to prove to them that you could do what they needed of you. Now it seems that cablers will need the endorsements to legally do the work, the modules required to get the endorsements are hardly a secret. Specialised cabling in this instance is essentially anything beyond basic telephony cable.

#4 Caelum

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Posted 07 May 2012 - 07:18 PM

What Mordenakhnen has said... Looks like they're making having endorsements compulsory. Luckily i'm planning on doing all three endorsements to go with my OpenReg in the next month... Which also works out nicely, as i'm likely to be doing work with all three in the next month too! So far i've done all of them, but not in quantity... Got some big projects in my very near future. It's a one week course, if you do all three. Not a big deal. Granted, it's about $1000+, but if you're working in the construction industry, that gets dropped to about $350, from memory.
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#5 sociopath

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Posted 08 May 2012 - 08:38 AM

For thoe who don't know this stuff: the ACMA and their Open/Restricted registration, is essentially your authority to work on internal cabling (residential and commercial) - which does not extend beyond the property's boundary. Note the ACMA's press release refers to "cabling providers who are undertaking the relevant specialised cabling work within customer premises"

Installers working in this space will not be able to do anything in terms of NBN fibre other than plug their NTD into the NBN's Premises Connection Device (PCD). Certainly as increasing numbers of commercial customers, (and non-commercial to some extent) seek to bring the fibre to the desktop, the ACMA registered techie will need the appropriate endorsements to provide those types of installations.

Edited by sociopath, 08 May 2012 - 08:39 AM.

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#6 Xen

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Posted 08 May 2012 - 09:32 AM

IMO most jobs wherein people are "qualified" to do some form of work/activity should have either re-certification after certain periods or when additional forms of work are Grey-area covered by their existing qualification. I've seen a lot of people in many of the jobs i have worked in that would no long pass the current exams (electrical, cabling... driving licenses for professional drivers)

#7 twents

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Posted 08 May 2012 - 05:51 PM

IMO most jobs wherein people are "qualified" to do some form of work/activity should have either re-certification after certain periods or when additional forms of work are Grey-area covered by their existing qualification.

I've seen a lot of people in many of the jobs i have worked in that would no long pass the current exams (electrical, cabling... driving licenses for professional drivers)

just like the fat coppers ay... dont see them doin the beep test in anything less than 20
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#8 sociopath

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Posted 16 May 2012 - 04:50 PM

Here's the bit that I don't understand... When I want my driver's licence, I go to the applicable government agency, do a test (either computer based or actual practical driving test) and if I pass, my licence is issued. The people who issue the licence don't teach me in how to drive. I am required to learn the knowledge and skills THEN apply to be tested so they will issue my licence. However, if I want a licence(registration) to work in the telecommunications industry, the same people who train me, also test me and issue the licence. The training provider gets paid to deliver the training, administer the test and issue the registration. There is no real independence in the 'testing' process and as far as I can tell, no accountability on the trainer once the registration is issued. In my mind, that's the same as the driving school who taught me to drive also conducting my driving test and issuing my driver's licence. Yes? Shouldn't the training company provide me with the skills and knowledge, THEN I go to the registrar to apply for my Open Reg?
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#9 bushi

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Posted 16 May 2012 - 06:45 PM

I was actually thinking of this this morning. It seems like it's really more permission to be able to do the work more than anything. The exam is piss easy because they give you the answers to remember. I can't remember more than half the stuff from the course.
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#10 Caelum

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Posted 16 May 2012 - 08:53 PM

However, if I want a licence(registration) to work in the telecommunications industry, the same people who train me, also test me and issue the licence. The training provider gets paid to deliver the training, administer the test and issue the registration. There is no real independence in the 'testing' process and as far as I can tell, no accountability on the trainer once the registration is issued.


That's not how it works. Sure, you do the training and get tested for the training course by the RTO(Reg'd training Org), but the registration is handled by the registrars(duh). Without the registration it doesn't matter how well you did in your training, you still aren't legally allowed to work on the training until you get your little card that shows your registration number.




Shouldn't the training company provide me with the skills and knowledge, THEN I go to the registrar to apply for my Open Reg?



That's exactly what already happens. But what i assume you means to say was: "THEN I go to the registrato to apply for my Open Reg and they test me on my skills?"




Keep in mind, the training organisations are supposed to follow the syllabus set out by ACMA(which has its rules/regs derived from ACA, which had its rules/regs derived from AusTel, which had its rules/regs derived from Telecom Australia, which had its rules/regs derived from the Post Master General.... phew!).

Either way, it is NRT(Nationally recognised training), which means there is regulation and auditing in the training process. How often that happens is another story.. but the checks/procedures are supposed to be there to ensure that students are tested and trained according to the syllabus.



Not sure if you're reg'd, and if you are reg'd, who did your training... but i know the crew that i got trained at (and am going to be trained at again next week, for my structured, coax, and fibre endorsements) run a pretty slick operation - that means if you fail a test... you actually do fail the test.
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#11 sociopath

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Posted 17 May 2012 - 10:08 AM

Yep - sorry , I explained myself poorly... I go to the RTO and do the training. I get assessed by the RTO as 'competent' and sit an exam, quizing me on random cabling 'rules', administered by the same training provider, which I am required to achieve a minimum 80% to be 'passed' and issued the certificate I need to get my reg. So the point I am making is that the same people who train me also test me and give me the paperwork I need to get my reg from the registrar. By the way, the "exam" itself is completely at odds with nationally accepted "assessment principles" and which form part of the AQTF, which all RTOs are required to adopt. You cannot properly and fairly assess a person's knowledge through an exam like that. It's like giving me the Macquarie dictionary to read and two days later, asking me the definitions of a randomly chosen selection of words as a tool to assess my understanding of the English language. What if a candidate has literacy issues? What if he hasn't sat in a classroom or done an exam for many years and simply struggles? Does that make him less 'competent'? Seems like the ACMA and the likes of CITT have completely missed the point of adult learning and assessment principles...

Edited by sociopath, 17 May 2012 - 10:10 AM.

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#12 Caelum

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Posted 17 May 2012 - 10:42 AM

If you have(or anyone has) learning difficulties(to be broad), you should advise the RTO, so that they can manage your case. It's not up to them to ask you(or anyone else) if you(..or anyone else) has learning difficulties of any type. If you've got specific issues, it's entirely up to you to let the RTO know. It's not something they assume for everyone... if it was, there would be some particularly annoyed and frustrated students having to deal with all the other PC bullshit just on the off chance that someone in the class has literacy, maths, or some other kind of physical or mental problem. Speak up or shut up, basically. (despite the above, i'm actually very tolerant and supportive of those with difficulties)
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