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#441 gamble

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Posted 29 June 2018 - 02:47 PM

Ok pumping up the ram to 1.45v I can boot and everything seems fine so far, thx Dasa.  I had the ram at 1.35v for 2933, really happy to have 3200 :)  I guess I should have upped it more sooner

 

I need to research some to see at what point latency vs frequency is best, Im going to look into your charts in you sig again to see what I can see from it too. If possibly or if there is benefit to running higher frequency at the cost of some lost latency then might try it out.  Something to actually play with. (I have no clue if it will even boot with anything higher yet)

 

cpu-z

3200 - 16, 18, 22, 53, 75 1T is what xmp profile gives for 3200 which I ran at 2933.  30mins on prime passed.  

 

Few other notes, 68c temp is highest with all fans on low and pump at 60% with prime95.   GC probably needs to work in some more too.  Clocks with p95 range from 3850 to 4000mhz. Jumps a lot with p95 and not all running the same speed.  ~1.298v on the core mostly with some jumps, 1.441v the highest but I haven't seen it there but cpuid did. 

 

Cine:

SC:  169 (no improvement)

MC:  1318 (decent improvement)


HAF 912 | Biostar x370GT7 | 1700x @ 4ghz | Asus Strix GTX 1080ti @ 1962c/12000m | EVGA RAM @ 2933mhz  | EK Watercooled CPU | EVGA G2 1300W 


#442 Dasa

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Posted 29 June 2018 - 06:31 PM

https://www.overcloc...ity-thread.html

you should find some good info there on what sub timings work well for squeezing more out of ram on amd

 

with amd frequency is king provided timings are not blown totally out the window as the fabric is tied to the memory speed latency reduces as frequency goes up

i use aida64 to keep an eye on the rams final latency

 

turns out my increased stability with the latest bios was just a illusion although it was posting at 1t easier than it use to it still wasn't completely stable at anything over 3866c16

 

a test relevant to actual game performance improvement could be hard

most benchmarks like cinbench see next to no improvement from ram speed

firestrike next to nothing

timespy sees a small improvement maybe 5% when a game would see 20%

maybe the api overhead test?


Edited by Dasa, 29 June 2018 - 09:48 PM.

Silverstone TJ08-EW 6700k@4.6 1.35v - Z170-GENE - 2x8g 3733 16-16-16 - 1070@ 2000\4650MHz - Samsung 970 EVO 1TB, Sandisk Ultra II 960G, WD Green 3tb - Seasonic XP1050 - Dell U2713, Benq W1070 - Logitech Z680, Home theater system - Apogee Drive II - EK VGA-HF Supreme - Phobia 200mm Rad - Silverstone FM181 & AP181 Project Darkling
3770k vs 6700k RAM Scaling, HT vs RAM, Arma III CPU vs RAM, Thief CPU vs RAM
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#443 gamble

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Posted 30 June 2018 - 03:37 PM

Some results with 3200 and aida64 5.97.4600 benchmark.  Stress tested cpu, fpu cache and memory for 30mins on aida64.  3.5hrs on p95:

 

3200 @ 16-18-22-53 (as aida64 reports)

read:  47133mb/s

write:  44524

copy:  39661

latency:  71ns

 

3200 seems completely stable!

--

Testing now 3333 @ 16-18-23-55 (as aida64 reports)

read:  48807mb/s

write:  46235mb/s

copy:  40884mb/s

latency:  67.9ns

 

need to run stability tests.  

 

Some notes on temps too, they got much higher when running aida64 tests, up to 78c.  Cranked up the pump to 75% and fans for rad are at 1100rpm too for these runs.  Keeps it around 75c for the highest, and most time not near that, p95 doesnt get near that high even after hours...

 

I tried to post 3466, no go at these timings, it was just to see if it would since 3333 posted :)  Ill probably have to loosen the timings but pretty happy so far.  Benchmarks show no gains in FS or Timespy. 


Edited by gamble, 30 June 2018 - 03:40 PM.

HAF 912 | Biostar x370GT7 | 1700x @ 4ghz | Asus Strix GTX 1080ti @ 1962c/12000m | EVGA RAM @ 2933mhz  | EK Watercooled CPU | EVGA G2 1300W 


#444 Dasa

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Posted 30 June 2018 - 07:02 PM

nice latency is getting to a much better level

im guessing your ram is using hynix chips if so this may be handy

you can use thaiphoon burner to confirm what chips it has

 

https://www.overcloc...ml#post26242714

Few more DRAM timing presets:

Hynix AFR, 1DPC SR

"Safe"

ea5bb6ba_AFR-3200S.png

- ProcODT 60 Ohms
- DRAM Voltage / DRAM Boot Voltage 1.340V (keep these syncronized at all times)
- VDDCR_SOC 1.025V

"Extreme"

24310b0d_AFR-3200E.png

- ProcODT 60 Ohms
- DRAM Voltage / DRAM Boot Voltage 1.405V (keep these syncronized at all times)
- VDDCR_SOC 1.025V

Hynix MFR, 1DPC SR

"Safe"

2ee87dd2_MFR-3200S.png

- ProcODT 60 Ohms
- DRAM Voltage / DRAM Boot Voltage 1.365V (keep these syncronized at all times)
- VDDCR_SOC 1.025V

"Fast"

86e7ba86_MFR-3200F.png

- ProcODT 60 Ohms
- DRAM Voltage / DRAM Boot Voltage 1.390V (keep these syncronized at all times)
- VDDCR_SOC 1.025V

 

or you can find his b die presets here

https://www.overcloc...ml#post26178558

 

these are all for the asus corshair mb though so your mileage may vary


Edited by Dasa, 30 June 2018 - 07:05 PM.

Silverstone TJ08-EW 6700k@4.6 1.35v - Z170-GENE - 2x8g 3733 16-16-16 - 1070@ 2000\4650MHz - Samsung 970 EVO 1TB, Sandisk Ultra II 960G, WD Green 3tb - Seasonic XP1050 - Dell U2713, Benq W1070 - Logitech Z680, Home theater system - Apogee Drive II - EK VGA-HF Supreme - Phobia 200mm Rad - Silverstone FM181 & AP181 Project Darkling
3770k vs 6700k RAM Scaling, HT vs RAM, Arma III CPU vs RAM, Thief CPU vs RAM
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#445 gamble

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Posted 30 June 2018 - 11:54 PM

Thx Dasa! Yup hynix. I'll give those a try too.  I want to see if 3333 and maybe 3466 will be able to stay stable with looser timings too. 


HAF 912 | Biostar x370GT7 | 1700x @ 4ghz | Asus Strix GTX 1080ti @ 1962c/12000m | EVGA RAM @ 2933mhz  | EK Watercooled CPU | EVGA G2 1300W 


#446 Dasa

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Posted 01 July 2018 - 08:52 AM

just realized those timings would have been for first gen ryzen given the date of the post so you can probably tighten them up more than that

 

this tool may be of help to

https://www.overcloc...g-dram-am4.html

 


Silverstone TJ08-EW 6700k@4.6 1.35v - Z170-GENE - 2x8g 3733 16-16-16 - 1070@ 2000\4650MHz - Samsung 970 EVO 1TB, Sandisk Ultra II 960G, WD Green 3tb - Seasonic XP1050 - Dell U2713, Benq W1070 - Logitech Z680, Home theater system - Apogee Drive II - EK VGA-HF Supreme - Phobia 200mm Rad - Silverstone FM181 & AP181 Project Darkling
3770k vs 6700k RAM Scaling, HT vs RAM, Arma III CPU vs RAM, Thief CPU vs RAM
Parts Guide


#447 gamble

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Posted 02 July 2018 - 02:26 PM

Thanks once again Dasa :)  I used thaiphoon burner and calculator to tweak some settings for 3200.  I was unable to get 3333 stable with more volts or higher timings, it would eventually fail some tests or lockup.   At 3200 my mb would not let me go any lower than 16, even it I set to 15 it would go to 16.  Played with tons of setting and even the safe setting would give some problems.  I settled with setting the main 5 timings and working with those, goal was to get to under 70ns and ended with 70.8.  All in all it was really enjoyable playing and testing things out.  Had a strange thing with reports for my hynix ram as it would give a ? for the AFR or MFR:  

 

H5AN8G8N?FR-TFC

 

So, I tried all safe, fast and extreme settings but I guess mine is picky or my mb is as it didnt seem to want me to play with all timing for some reason.  Even if I did straight what xmp gave, if I put those in it would lock up.. Strange stuff.  I could put in some setting and it would work fine. 

 

3200 @ 16-18-18-42 CR1 (as aida64 reports) 2hrs of aida64 stress / p95 1hr

read:  47280mb/s

write:  44891

copy:  40333

latency:  70.8ns

 

Just a side note, Windows was acting kinda weird so I thought I would do fresh install. MB came with m.2 sata3 240gb with 530mb/s read / 410mb/s write.  I had bought a mydigitalssd to replace it, but it wouldn't work last year, probably because of how fresh bios and platform was back at release. Thought I would try it again for my os drive and it worked great, super fast, I forgot to test the biostar m200 that came with mb but tested against my vertex4:

 

m.2 pce 3.0 x4, 2600mb/s read / 1300mb/s

 

Test Block Size Result CPU% Drive
Linear Read (Begin) 8 MB 1969.7 MB/s 0 % Disk Drive #3  [BPX]  (111.8 GB)
Linear Read (Middle) 8 MB 2644.0 MB/s 3 % Disk Drive #3  [BPX]  (111.8 GB)
Linear Read (End) 8 MB 2716.1 MB/s 0 % Disk Drive #3  [BPX]  (111.8 GB)
Random Read 8 MB 2237.0 MB/s 3 % Disk Drive #3  [BPX]  (111.8 GB)
Buffered Read 1 MB 2448.6 MB/s 0 % Disk Drive #3  [BPX]  (111.8 GB)
Average Read Access  0.06 ms 1 % Disk Drive #3  [BPX]  (111.8 GB)

 

Linear Read (Begin) 256 KB 425.5 MB/s 1 % Disk Drive #1  [OCZ-VERTEX4]  (476.9 GB)
Linear Read (Middle) 256 KB 433.0 MB/s 0 % Disk Drive #1  [OCZ-VERTEX4]  (476.9 GB)
Linear Read (End) 256 KB 427.5 MB/s 3 % Disk Drive #1  [OCZ-VERTEX4]  (476.9 GB)
Random Read 256 KB 416.3 MB/s 0 % Disk Drive #1  [OCZ-VERTEX4]  (476.9 GB)
Buffered Read 8 MB 357.2 MB/s 1 % Disk Drive #1  [OCZ-VERTEX4]  (476.9 GB)
Average Read Access  0.11 ms 1 % Disk Drive #1  [OCZ-VERTEX4]  (476.9 GB)

 

Few other notes for the cpu... I see it boosting all core over 4200mhz quite a bit, it is running a bit cooler as I have upped my fans/pump.  It is running over 1.4v+ a lot.  Its strange for the manual OC that it doesnt want to play well.  Im going to try offsetting again and a few bumps with volts in other areas.  I mean if it is running 4250+ I should be able to get all core locked down with maybe 1.45v @ 4.2.  When p95 or aida64 is running all cores sit around 4ghz.  I see they are going to come out with precision boost OC soon too, might be worth waiting for.   Timespy give 9370 with these timings. 


HAF 912 | Biostar x370GT7 | 1700x @ 4ghz | Asus Strix GTX 1080ti @ 1962c/12000m | EVGA RAM @ 2933mhz  | EK Watercooled CPU | EVGA G2 1300W 


#448 Dasa

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Posted 02 July 2018 - 08:35 PM

with all those sub timing settings above there may be just a few of them that your mb doesn't like and a few that it does

 

tweaking sub timings make a bigger difference for me than primary

top three for me are

tRFC <mostly this one from ~500 down to 310 but you probably wont get this low with hynix on amd

and i think these two helped a bit but cant be sure anymore

tFAW

tWCL

doubling tREF can help bandwidth a little but its instability is more likely to show up after idle periods than during a stress test so careful with it

 

mind taking a screenshot of what your sub timings are at?


Edited by Dasa, 02 July 2018 - 09:29 PM.

Silverstone TJ08-EW 6700k@4.6 1.35v - Z170-GENE - 2x8g 3733 16-16-16 - 1070@ 2000\4650MHz - Samsung 970 EVO 1TB, Sandisk Ultra II 960G, WD Green 3tb - Seasonic XP1050 - Dell U2713, Benq W1070 - Logitech Z680, Home theater system - Apogee Drive II - EK VGA-HF Supreme - Phobia 200mm Rad - Silverstone FM181 & AP181 Project Darkling
3770k vs 6700k RAM Scaling, HT vs RAM, Arma III CPU vs RAM, Thief CPU vs RAM
Parts Guide


#449 gamble

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Posted 03 July 2018 - 11:57 AM

Sure, please see below:

 

https://photos.app.g...CcD5HXiiimJgn68

https://photos.app.g...5uYLKxQ3YMLbFXA

 

 

Still playing around a bit, trying to see if I can lower the timings some and volts to 1.433. 

 

I cannot OC all core really at all 4.2ghz will not happen but 4.1 will but with crazy volts, so not worth it.  All in all Im still happy with this chip, seems faster for everything compared to my 1700x. 

 

I might need to try the trfc like you mentioned, but is at 312 already.  I cant believe what good timings you have at that frequency!


Edited by gamble, 03 July 2018 - 12:54 PM.

HAF 912 | Biostar x370GT7 | 1700x @ 4ghz | Asus Strix GTX 1080ti @ 1962c/12000m | EVGA RAM @ 2933mhz  | EK Watercooled CPU | EVGA G2 1300W 


#450 Dasa

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Posted 03 July 2018 - 06:37 PM

nice you got tRFC a lot tighter than i expected

 

yes b die does handle tight timings nicely apparently it can typically bench around 4000c13 with ~2vdimm

this is what im currently running 1.43vdimm set but its actually reported as being at 1.408v in software

i don't think this is 100% stable though i need to run some overnight tests

 

ram%20speed.jpg


Silverstone TJ08-EW 6700k@4.6 1.35v - Z170-GENE - 2x8g 3733 16-16-16 - 1070@ 2000\4650MHz - Samsung 970 EVO 1TB, Sandisk Ultra II 960G, WD Green 3tb - Seasonic XP1050 - Dell U2713, Benq W1070 - Logitech Z680, Home theater system - Apogee Drive II - EK VGA-HF Supreme - Phobia 200mm Rad - Silverstone FM181 & AP181 Project Darkling
3770k vs 6700k RAM Scaling, HT vs RAM, Arma III CPU vs RAM, Thief CPU vs RAM
Parts Guide


#451 gamble

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Posted 04 July 2018 - 04:35 PM

Playing BF1 for 2hrs... you can see where it boosts above 4ghz (all core are at 4ghz when gaming and goes up from there at times) as the temp goes to 62-64c, then drops back to 54c.  I turned my fans down to 1000rpm and pump is around 65%.   Some false readings for the Max clock speed for sure.  TMPIN0 is 20c below always vs Package temp.  The Biostar comes with a heatsink for the m.2. Before I ran the m.2 with the heatsink off since I didn't know if it would work like last year.  Noticed it ran 60c and up to 68c but after putting on the heatsink, it is sitting at 39c right now, so It's doing a great job. I have my games on my Vertex4 so not sure why it goes up, possibly from the gpu dumping heat.   Keeping Ram at 3200 16-17-19-53 CR1.
 
 

temps.jpg

 

Edit:

 

Looks like just giving a bit more volts to the ram I can run 16-16-18-53 CR1 and get just under 70ns at 69.4 :)  Only tested for an hr but will run it thru the longer tests soon:

 

3200 @ 16-16-18-53 CR1

read:  47176mb/s

write:  45045

copy:  40467

latency:  69.4ns

 

cachemem16_16_18_53.png

 

 

Edit:

18.5hrs 

 

stabilitytest12.png

 

 

Edit:

 

Well it was just driving me crazy why nothing seemed to work for OC.  I can see all the cores in light loads over 4100mhz.  I was for some reason thinking llc was lvl 1 was the highest and it is actually lvl 6.. dunno what I was thinking.  Few other things, before to get to 1.4v for the 1700x using adaptive at +.095, but for this chip it is +.205v which is much different.  Other issues is that it does not down clock the volts or clocks at all, even with llc off.  Still don't really fell it is worth it to OC since even at 1.408v it fails one worker p95 within 5mins @ 4.2ghz. The 1700x at 4ghz would downclock both volts and clocks... Probably my bios, will revisit on next bios update.  


Edited by gamble, 07 July 2018 - 08:38 AM.

HAF 912 | Biostar x370GT7 | 1700x @ 4ghz | Asus Strix GTX 1080ti @ 1962c/12000m | EVGA RAM @ 2933mhz  | EK Watercooled CPU | EVGA G2 1300W 


#452 Dasa

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Posted 08 July 2018 - 10:39 AM

congrats on getting under 70ns

i had to drop back to 3733 to get the above stable at 1.408v i tried setting it up to 1.4825vdimm but it didn't help also had similar instability in hci memtest at 3733c15 and 3733 1t

but i have been able to drop the tRFC down to 300

 

i think this cpu needs a delid

1.395v 4.7ghz hits 80-85c instantly under prime kill the load and it instantly drops back to 20-25c idle

 

the l1 cache and memory latency on amd is a bit slower but the l2 and l3 cache are impressive providing a fair bit more bandwidth at a similar latency to my overclocked 6700k


Edited by Dasa, 08 July 2018 - 10:50 AM.

Silverstone TJ08-EW 6700k@4.6 1.35v - Z170-GENE - 2x8g 3733 16-16-16 - 1070@ 2000\4650MHz - Samsung 970 EVO 1TB, Sandisk Ultra II 960G, WD Green 3tb - Seasonic XP1050 - Dell U2713, Benq W1070 - Logitech Z680, Home theater system - Apogee Drive II - EK VGA-HF Supreme - Phobia 200mm Rad - Silverstone FM181 & AP181 Project Darkling
3770k vs 6700k RAM Scaling, HT vs RAM, Arma III CPU vs RAM, Thief CPU vs RAM
Parts Guide


#453 gamble

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Posted 08 July 2018 - 04:19 PM

They have some cool delid kits now.  I did the razor way, it was stressful and took me forever as I was scared I would hit the core :) Would you do direct die or put ihs back on?

 

https://www.rockitcool.com.au

Ebay has cheaper prices and different types. Maybe some grizzly. Haven't had a look but wondering if others with 6700k gained good temps from it. 


Edited by gamble, 08 July 2018 - 04:43 PM.

HAF 912 | Biostar x370GT7 | 1700x @ 4ghz | Asus Strix GTX 1080ti @ 1962c/12000m | EVGA RAM @ 2933mhz  | EK Watercooled CPU | EVGA G2 1300W 


#454 Dasa

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Posted 08 July 2018 - 06:37 PM

i ended up deliding my 3770k with vise hairdryer method after i found the gap wasn't big enough to get a blade in

had to smash the crap out of it with the hammer till it flew out of the vise ripping chunks out of the ihs and knocking one of the chips for the igp off the back

eventually got it with some minor damage to the pcb edges

i like to put the ihs back on these days its just safer and easier to make sure the cpu is getting good contact in the socket with lga

 

still have some liquid ultra left to go under there if i feel like pushing harder but i don't think i would gain much with this cpu


Silverstone TJ08-EW 6700k@4.6 1.35v - Z170-GENE - 2x8g 3733 16-16-16 - 1070@ 2000\4650MHz - Samsung 970 EVO 1TB, Sandisk Ultra II 960G, WD Green 3tb - Seasonic XP1050 - Dell U2713, Benq W1070 - Logitech Z680, Home theater system - Apogee Drive II - EK VGA-HF Supreme - Phobia 200mm Rad - Silverstone FM181 & AP181 Project Darkling
3770k vs 6700k RAM Scaling, HT vs RAM, Arma III CPU vs RAM, Thief CPU vs RAM
Parts Guide


#455 gamble

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Posted 10 July 2018 - 01:40 AM

Yea might not be worth it, whats the temps when stock with prime?  

 

I contacted hci_memtest to see what they recommend for testing, below is their answer:

 

"100% catches the easy errors, 400% to catch intermittent errors."

 

Im testing hci_memtest 16-16-17-42 CR1 and seems to be good @ 3200 with 1.47v.  This didnt really improve my scores though and latency is nearly the same but Ryzen really like Ram speed it seems.  Even though during games like bf1 my cores are usually around 4ghz (I ran 1700x at 4ghz on all cores) and boost up some from there, it just feels smoother.  I dont know why but there is less micro stutters and such.  


Edited by gamble, 10 July 2018 - 01:45 AM.

HAF 912 | Biostar x370GT7 | 1700x @ 4ghz | Asus Strix GTX 1080ti @ 1962c/12000m | EVGA RAM @ 2933mhz  | EK Watercooled CPU | EVGA G2 1300W 


#456 Dasa

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Posted 10 July 2018 - 08:31 AM

For hci i find 400% is the minimum when running 8 instances at once with ~1777mb each so that all threads are covered and all ram is used I like to leave it run overnight so that each has 1200 coverage just to be sure

but it will usually find any bad errors in the first 50-200%

I find hci is very heavy on the cache and is great for finding errors related to the memory controller but a bit slower than linux gsat for finding memory related errors


Silverstone TJ08-EW 6700k@4.6 1.35v - Z170-GENE - 2x8g 3733 16-16-16 - 1070@ 2000\4650MHz - Samsung 970 EVO 1TB, Sandisk Ultra II 960G, WD Green 3tb - Seasonic XP1050 - Dell U2713, Benq W1070 - Logitech Z680, Home theater system - Apogee Drive II - EK VGA-HF Supreme - Phobia 200mm Rad - Silverstone FM181 & AP181 Project Darkling
3770k vs 6700k RAM Scaling, HT vs RAM, Arma III CPU vs RAM, Thief CPU vs RAM
Parts Guide


#457 SceptreCore

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Posted 13 July 2018 - 03:56 PM

I don't want to be 'that guy' gamble... but having a biostar board you're already at a performance disadvantage. 

 

Sorry if you're a biostar fan.


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#458 gamble

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Posted 14 July 2018 - 05:05 AM

nah, I agree with you!  It was the only board I could get when Ryzen was first released, there was a huge shortage with weeks of wait time on mb's.  They gave a free m.2 sata 240g drive with it, good price and had really good vrm setup.  It's the bios releases that is a pain when you hear of other mb getting releases quicker.  It's a good board just I really like Asrock for price/performance.  Also, at the time my old system was dead and was already waiting for AMD release as I wanted to go back to AMD.  I kinda wish I waited but oh well, all is running good now after tweaking ram and really the 2600x is a good chip all around.  I really cant wait till next year's Ryzen refresh, might upgrade my mb too then :)


HAF 912 | Biostar x370GT7 | 1700x @ 4ghz | Asus Strix GTX 1080ti @ 1962c/12000m | EVGA RAM @ 2933mhz  | EK Watercooled CPU | EVGA G2 1300W 


#459 SceptreCore

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Posted 14 July 2018 - 01:09 PM

I really cant wait till next year's Ryzen refresh, might upgrade my mb too then :)

Hard to believe that we're already staring down at the 7nm Zen 2 hey!


RIG: Phenom II X6 1090T @ 4.0GHz | MSI 990FXA GD-80 | 8GB Corsair Vengeance @ 1600MHz 9-9-9-24 | MSI Radeon R7 370 | Patriot Pyro SSD 120GB SATAIII | 500GB + 1TB Barracuda's | LG GH22NS70 DVD-RW | Xigmatek Red Scorpion | Corsair HX650W | CM690


#460 SceptreCore

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Posted 14 July 2018 - 01:35 PM

Not sure I like this:

 

https://arstechnica....ver-processors/


RIG: Phenom II X6 1090T @ 4.0GHz | MSI 990FXA GD-80 | 8GB Corsair Vengeance @ 1600MHz 9-9-9-24 | MSI Radeon R7 370 | Patriot Pyro SSD 120GB SATAIII | 500GB + 1TB Barracuda's | LG GH22NS70 DVD-RW | Xigmatek Red Scorpion | Corsair HX650W | CM690





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