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Asus P6X58D-E mobo, memory upgrade, SSD upgrade, Win10 upgrade


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#1 Belisarius76

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 09:57 AM

Hi all,

 

Forums seem quite dead compared to when I was floating around here previously a couple years ago briefly (also I've lost the login password of my main Belisarius account sadly that was started way back when Atomicmpc first started, hence this account).

 

I digress to the topic at hand.

 

I have 2 PCs still working with ASUS P6X58D-E, 5-6 years on, purchased brand new back in a day. Bios 0502. I still use a PC running Win7 64bit Pro, with a Core i7 960 3.2Ghz for work, it runs Revit 2016 fine with my installed 6GB Corsair Dominator 1600 DDR3 triple channel RAM, 600GB WD Velociraptor SATA3 and an already upgraded 4GB Gigabyte GTX970 Windforce in the machine. My second machine from this era is exactly the same but running a 2GB Gigabyte GTX770 Windforce graphics card.

Games wise I've predominantly played WoW, Empire total war, BF3/BF4 and other assorted strategy games over the years, none strain on a 24" with 1080p, hence my reluctance nor drive to update my PC/buy a new PC build until early in 2015.

 

I now have a LAN in my house, we play BF1, and what I noticed with the current PC via Resource Monitor is the CPU is fine, the RAM capacity is not fine, the game spikes at 100% of RAM usage with 6GB installed. I pulled the almost identically similar {edit: when I say almost identically similar CMP6GX3M3A1600C7 vs TR3X6G1600C8D both run at 533Mhz at 8-8-8-20 1.5V in their respective machines}, 6GB Corsair Dominator 1600 DDR3 from my other machine and occupied all 6 triple channel slots for a total of 12GB RAM and the game ran flawlessly on Ultra settings 1080p with the GTX970. The GTX770 is starting to struggle tbh. BF1 really has been the first time I've seen these PCs start to struggle on 1080p with crashes, lag spikes etc which seem to have been corrected with latest 376.48 NVidia drivers, BF1 console command prompt script routine placed under BF1 directory, and an upgrade in RAM from 6GB to 12GB.  

 

I intend to use the PC for work and play still and wanted to make a few upgrades as the title suggests.

 

My queries are as follows:

 

1. I've purchased Win10 64bit Pro retail and will transfer this to my next PC in a year or two. I presume if a driver cannot be found a generic driver will be utilized by Windows 10 to fill the gap? How does say a Win7-8.1 driver work inside Win10 as a last resort? I may just stay with Win 7 64 pro if there are too many issues.

 

2. I have a new 500GB Samsung 850EVO SSD drive I want to replace the 600GB WD Velociraptor with. My board has native Intel ICH10R controller with 6x SATA 3GB/s ports and a Marvell PCIe 9128 controller which supplies 2x SATA 6GB/s ports. Now I'm wondering if there will be noticeable loss in performance using a 3GB/s port over a 6GB/s port? As I've seen issues noted online with Windows 7 and installing a SATA HDD to the Marvell 6GB/s controller on fresh install and getting the drive to work without the drivers installed properly first (actually the guy totally corrupted his HDD doing this apparently), so I presume I'll have to use the native Intel controller first during Win10 install and then maybe use a Win7/8.1 driver that is applicable for the Marvell controller and then switch the drive over after to the 6GB/s Marvell controller? If anyone has done a similar thing on an older platform, if they had any advice on this?

 

3. On the memory side of things, I have on a courier at this very moment purchased 2x12GB triple channel kits for a total of 24GB, exactly the same 12GB Corsair Vengeance 1600 DDR3 (CMZ12GX3M3A1600C9). If I wanted to plug these into the 2 triple channels on the board, surely they would compliment each other and run both in triple channel? They are exactly the same kit, although not 6 DIMMs in a kit, they are theoretically meant to be the same. Is CPU-Z the programme I can use to check if theyre running in Triple channel or not? Or is there another way to determine they are running efficiently in triple channel mode? {edit} although I pulled the near identical 6GB kits from my other older PC and placed in this PC briefly, I did not check whether they were running in triple channel via CPU-Z previously whilst playing BF1, the game was 100% flawless, so presumed it just worked. I've just seen comments from 2009 onwards, warning about kits of the same type (separate kits still, but meant to be exactly the same product) not necessarily working in multi-channel RAM mode, if anyone could help on this? My current RAM on both older PCs defaults to 533Mhz 8-8-8-20 timings at 1.5V but is rated at 1.65V. I'm presuming the standard default 1.5V on the Vengeance will also default back to 533Mhz at 1.5V and work ok?

 

thanks for your time.


Edited by Belisarius76, 06 January 2017 - 10:24 AM.

PC 1: Intel Core i7 5930k / Intel BXTS13X Cooler / ASUS X99-A / 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX 2400Mhz DDR4 / 8GB Asus GTX1070 DualOC / 500GB Samsung 850EVO SSD / 2TB WD Black HDD / Logitech G105 / Logitech G700s / Logitech G430 headset / Thermaltake Core V51 / Seasonic SS-760XPII 80+ Platinum

PC 2: Intel Core i7 960 / Intel BXRTS2011LC Cooler / ASUS P6X58D-E / 24GB Corsair Vengeance 1600Mhz DDR3 / 4GB Gigabyte GTX970 WF / 500GB Samsung 850EVO SSD / 600GB WD Velociraptor SATA3 / 2TB WD Black SATA3 HDD / Logitech G105 / Logitech G502 / Thermaltake Chaser Mk-1 / Seasonic X-670 80+ Gold


#2 Dasa

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 10:47 AM

apparently bf1 can see fps drop well below 60fps due to cpu much more powerful than that in large online games

 

1. probably

 

2.the ssd may be a bit slower on sataii but still a lot quicker than using a hdd

 

3. mixing and matching ram is usually fine but sometimes its not only one way to find out


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#3 Jeruselem

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 10:50 AM

SATA 2 may hobble the SSD performance but you'll still see a huge performance boost anyway.

I have noticed Win10 has issues with getting drivers for really ancient hardware but you'll need Win10 for new motherboards as some new chipsets might not get drivers for Win7.


Edited by Jeruselem, 06 January 2017 - 10:56 AM.

Cortana at your service


#4 Rybags

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 11:10 AM

Re SSD and Sata, note that the rates are Gb not GB.  So figure 300 Meg/second for Sata2 and 600 Meg for Sata3.

 

My box here is similar era, Xeon of the first i7 generation but it's LGA1366 which means triple-channel Ram as well as more grunt over PCIe.

 

I've got an SSD as well, to get anywhere near the full performance from a half-decent SSD you will want Sata3.  With Sata2 you'll be lucky to approach 300 Meg/second, with mine I think I benched it at something like 380 Meg/second on a Sata3 card in a PCIe 2.0 slot.

 

So, the thing to do is get a cheap PCIe Sata3 card but that only becomes worthwhile if you have a PCIe 2.0 or better slot to put it into.  Most cheap Sata3 cards will support PCIe 2.0 or better but the usual case is they're only x1 cards.  Doing it with PCIe 1.0 x1 is somewhat pointless since that's 250 Meg/second which is slower than a native Sata2 port.

 

Triple channel "kits" - it's bullshit really, all you're doing is getting Ram that's a matched set, you could equally get 3 sets of pairs of the same branding for the same effect.  Intel's dual and triple channel will usually work without having to populate all slots, but supposedly the best performance is to be had when it's a symetrical setup, ie same size and specs in every slot.



#5 Belisarius76

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 06:26 PM

thanks fellas for replies.

 

I think doing some more reading I'll just install this SSD on the Intel ICH10 controller, I might once installed flip it over to the Marvel 9128 controller and see what happens, never know, may be lucky and not have as many issues as other poor buggers have had with it over the years looking on the net. I'm sure the load times will improve....hopefully anyway lol.

 

Is there any programme I can use to check if the RAM is actually definitively running in multi-channel mode (in this case triple channel)? Is CPU-Z as good as any to check this? Or is there another third party software you guys have ever bothered to use to check such things? 

 

 


PC 1: Intel Core i7 5930k / Intel BXTS13X Cooler / ASUS X99-A / 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX 2400Mhz DDR4 / 8GB Asus GTX1070 DualOC / 500GB Samsung 850EVO SSD / 2TB WD Black HDD / Logitech G105 / Logitech G700s / Logitech G430 headset / Thermaltake Core V51 / Seasonic SS-760XPII 80+ Platinum

PC 2: Intel Core i7 960 / Intel BXRTS2011LC Cooler / ASUS P6X58D-E / 24GB Corsair Vengeance 1600Mhz DDR3 / 4GB Gigabyte GTX970 WF / 500GB Samsung 850EVO SSD / 600GB WD Velociraptor SATA3 / 2TB WD Black SATA3 HDD / Logitech G105 / Logitech G502 / Thermaltake Chaser Mk-1 / Seasonic X-670 80+ Gold


#6 Dasa

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 06:48 PM

cpu z is good

if you also want to benchmark it to see that the bandwidth is increasing you could use aida64


Silverstone TJ08-EW 6700k@4.7 1.375v - Z170-GENE - 2x8g 3866 16-16-16 - 1070@ 2100\9600MHz  -Samsung 830 64G, Sandisk Ultra II 960G, WD Green 3tb - Seasonic XP1050 - Dell U2713 - Pioneer Todoroki 5.1 Apogee Drive II - EK VGA-HF Supreme  - Phobia 200mm Rad - Silverstone AP181 Project Darkling
3770k vs 6700k RAM Scaling, HT vs RAM, Arma III CPU vs RAM, Thief CPU vs RAM
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#7 Belisarius76

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Posted 07 January 2017 - 10:27 AM

thanks Dasa


PC 1: Intel Core i7 5930k / Intel BXTS13X Cooler / ASUS X99-A / 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX 2400Mhz DDR4 / 8GB Asus GTX1070 DualOC / 500GB Samsung 850EVO SSD / 2TB WD Black HDD / Logitech G105 / Logitech G700s / Logitech G430 headset / Thermaltake Core V51 / Seasonic SS-760XPII 80+ Platinum

PC 2: Intel Core i7 960 / Intel BXRTS2011LC Cooler / ASUS P6X58D-E / 24GB Corsair Vengeance 1600Mhz DDR3 / 4GB Gigabyte GTX970 WF / 500GB Samsung 850EVO SSD / 600GB WD Velociraptor SATA3 / 2TB WD Black SATA3 HDD / Logitech G105 / Logitech G502 / Thermaltake Chaser Mk-1 / Seasonic X-670 80+ Gold


#8 Master_Scythe

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Posted 09 January 2017 - 12:58 PM

1. You shouldn't hit driver issues on Windows 10.

I have a client who uses old 90's architect plotter gear with pens on rods, and it had drivers for that......

 

2. IIRC, those era Marvell controllers were flakey at best.

I never had issues with mine either; but if its possible to make it live on the Intel, and move things like CD roms to the Marvell, I'd do that.

 

3. Assuming that board is OK with all 6 slots occupied, yep, it'll run triple channel with 6.  CPUz will do fine for letting you know :)


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#9 Belisarius76

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Posted 09 January 2017 - 03:55 PM

So whilst waiting for this 24GB Corsair Vengeance to arrive still, I ripped out the 6GB Corsair Dominator TR3X6G1600CD8 from my other machine and placed it with the 6GB Corsair Dominator CMP6GX3M3A1600C7 in triple channel again.

I ran CPU-Z v1.78 and it did indeed say it was running in "Triple" Channel, also noticed under the SPD tab that ranking is Dual, when it's 6GB and 12GB respectively, so that seems to be in unison as well, (my Quad channel X99 system has "single" ranking with the DDR4) even though they aren't theoretically the same kit so to speak. They default back to 533Mhz at 8-8-8-20 timings both of them and 1.5V, these kits had a default 1.65V voltage at 1600Mhz. So one would suspect having exactly the same kits with the same timings it shouldn't be an issue with the Corsair Vengeance I just purchased which default is 1600Mhz at 1.5V, should run 1066Mhz (533Mhz) at 1.5V easily you would suspect.

 

I also ran Aida64 Extreme trial edition for now. I noticed a latency increase with the 12GB installed. It went from 71.2ns with the 6GB installed to 73.6ns with 12GB installed. Also other read/write tests were slightly lower score (i.e. worse), not by much but I noticed a slight decrease in performance.

Performed a 3DMark2011 test as well on this old system, not overclocked at all and achieved a 11800~ (no SSD, 12GB Corsair Dominator RAM installed only), so nothing on todays systems, I mean looking at the online results overclocked similar systems were anywhere from 13-18k approx. back in 2011 with SLi graphics installed, just did it out of interest more than anything, as this machine runs BF1 on 1080p (24" monitor) easily without any hiccups with the 12GB of RAM installed, the 6GB RAM has random dropouts etc which is inline with the minimum system requirements of 8GB RAM, I've noticed it using anywhere from 6-7.5GB of RAM on the heavy maps.

 

I'll play around with the HDD etc on both controllers and post what I find.

 

And yeah cheers Master_Scythe


Edited by Belisarius76, 09 January 2017 - 04:05 PM.

PC 1: Intel Core i7 5930k / Intel BXTS13X Cooler / ASUS X99-A / 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX 2400Mhz DDR4 / 8GB Asus GTX1070 DualOC / 500GB Samsung 850EVO SSD / 2TB WD Black HDD / Logitech G105 / Logitech G700s / Logitech G430 headset / Thermaltake Core V51 / Seasonic SS-760XPII 80+ Platinum

PC 2: Intel Core i7 960 / Intel BXRTS2011LC Cooler / ASUS P6X58D-E / 24GB Corsair Vengeance 1600Mhz DDR3 / 4GB Gigabyte GTX970 WF / 500GB Samsung 850EVO SSD / 600GB WD Velociraptor SATA3 / 2TB WD Black SATA3 HDD / Logitech G105 / Logitech G502 / Thermaltake Chaser Mk-1 / Seasonic X-670 80+ Gold





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