Jump to content


Photo

Woo! Star trek Discovery! (spoilers, probably)

The Firm Boldly going forwards Because we cant find reverse

  • Please log in to reply
73 replies to this topic

#1 fredzfrog

fredzfrog

    Guru

  • Hero
  • 12,597 posts

Posted 25 September 2017 - 11:48 PM

Hey folks, so, new trek, whats your thoughts?

Me? I've missed it a bit. This one looks rather fresh and JJ Abrams style, but aparantly from the original series timeline. I'd put forward that it may be it's own timeline, but who knows.

New Klingons! They do look a lot more beastly..

Starfleet tech looks nice too.. And the crack of the incoming warps was awesome.

Onto procedures tho, why is it always the senior staff/bridge officers who go on away missions. Surely with a complement of about 200 personnel on board they could have a dedicated assault team. Yes yes, I know, peace love and unity, thats the federation. But even tng had section 31.
Increases your chance of love by 75.3%

#2 scruffy1

scruffy1

    Champion

  • Hero
  • 5,374 posts
  • Location:near the beach

Posted 26 September 2017 - 12:13 AM

but it's mandatory for any landing party to have an expendable junior crew member who has never been identified in any previous episodes, and will be cannon fodder in any altercation  :)


ummmmmmmmmmm............


#3 Rybags

Rybags

    Immortal

  • Super Hero
  • 35,058 posts

Posted 26 September 2017 - 12:40 AM

I am not reading this.

I am not reading this.

 

I've got 2 eps here and will get back to this thread once I've at least watched the first.

 

I suppose if it's not up to expectations I should give it a chance.  But the ST universe for me has been a big disappointment in recent times.

Not a fan of reboots and rewriting history as it seems the new movies are doing.

Lost interest in ST:  Ent after a short time due to it being somewhat of a turd.

 

But on the other hand - ST:  TNG - it was a miracle that it survived beyond the first 2 years.  There were very few decent episodes surrounded by astonishingly bad ones.  The excellent casting (except the series 2 doctor) is probably what kept it treading water until the good storylines started coming through in the 3rd year.



#4 fredzfrog

fredzfrog

    Guru

  • Hero
  • 12,597 posts

Posted 26 September 2017 - 03:47 PM

I am not reading this.

I am not reading this.

 

I did warn about spoilers in the title..


Increases your chance of love by 75.3%

#5 stadl

stadl

    Guru

  • Super Hero
  • 9,047 posts

Posted 26 September 2017 - 04:34 PM

Haven't seen it yet. Will grab it when it comes out on bluray.

 

Onto procedures tho, why is it always the senior staff/bridge officers who go on away missions. Surely with a complement of about 200 personnel on board they could have a dedicated assault team. Yes yes, I know, peace love and unity, thats the federation. But even tng had section 31.

 

Always bugged me too, but I accept that that's they way they organise their cast. Senior bridge crew are the people with the most character development, so they do the interaction with the character of the week.

 

In my view it's a decision for a small key cast with a skattering of low development cast.  The paycheck and marquee status is tied to the military rank, so the captain needs to be on the away missions.

 

Worked that way in all the ST series, and also in B5, Same thing on many more 'contemporary' shows too (The last ship, some procedurals)

 

More realistic structure was something like SG1 for comparison, and the highest rank (The general or base leader) was part of the supporting ensemble - the main cast were mid-rank personnel who went on missions.

The ranks are probably a bit high, with colonels and majors running and shooting, but they weren't trying to run the country/command and visit ever where shoot everything.


A device so simple that it took a mind as brilliant as mine to create it! So brilliant, in fact, that simply by harnessing the power of one live frog, it... it... uhh... <poke> <poke> ... World domination has encountered a momentary setback. Talk amongst yourselves.


#6 Rybags

Rybags

    Immortal

  • Super Hero
  • 35,058 posts

Posted 26 September 2017 - 10:02 PM

Some nice space effects.

 

The PC'ness going on is cringeworthy at times though.  And please, the most senior human male on the bridge seems to be the shitkicker ensign/helmsman?

The science officer is a wimp, and could become this series version of Nelix (as in annoying).

First ep ends on a cliffhanger so you have to watch the second.  I might leave it for tomorrow.



#7 Nich...

Nich...

    Professional Tart

  • Mod
  • 43,269 posts
  • Location:Mexico

Posted 26 September 2017 - 10:36 PM

The PCness?


"I think it is a sad reflection on our civilization that while we can and do measure the temperature in the atmosphere of Venus we do not know what goes on inside our soufflés" -- Nicholas Kurti

#8 i_am_banned2

i_am_banned2

    Primarch

  • Atomican
  • 1,689 posts

Posted 27 September 2017 - 02:55 AM

The PCness?

 

Crew of USS Discovery:

 
Captain - Gabriel Lorca, white human male. (Acceptable)
 
First Officer - Michael Burnham, black human female. (Trying to sneak this through with a man's name. Disgraceful. Black women have no place on a Star Trek bridge)
 
Science Officer - Saru, alien male. (Probably promoting some sort of nauseating liberal agenda. Who knows what filth they're pushing these days)
 
Medical Officer - Paul Stamets, white human male. (Acceptab- NO WAIT HE'S A GAY HOMOSEXUAL. Completely unrealistic. No real navy would harbour such a deviant. Not to mention a medical doctor should know better)
 
Lieutenant - Ash Tyler, brown human male. (Suspicious. Probably just trying to appease all the terrorist apologist fans)
 
Cadet - Sylvia Tilly, white human female. (Yet ANOTHER woman. This is an insult to real servicemen everywhere)
 
 
And this is only the main characters. Imagine what supporting cast horrors await at the planet Transexual in the galaxy Transylvania (not confirmed, but their most likely destination). I hope no children are permitted to view this subversive propaganda.


#9 Cybes

Cybes

    Titan

  • Atomican
  • 18,054 posts
  • Location:Where I am

Posted 27 September 2017 - 11:01 AM

Crew of USS Discovery:


Either you are joking, or you have never watched any version of Star Trek. I'm assuming the former, but the internet has shown me things you people would never believe. ;p

"Reality does not care what you think." - Dr Richard Feynman
"There is no "I" in team." - "True.  I will not be found in any team."


#10 Rybags

Rybags

    Immortal

  • Super Hero
  • 35,058 posts

Posted 27 September 2017 - 04:28 PM

Didn't realise he was the Captain - I went in without any spoilering research beforehand.

 

But still, the walking on eggshells is just so blatant at times.  FFS, the Klingons on the verge of vapourizing them and they're worried about respecting their "customs".



#11 merlin13

merlin13

    Guru

  • Atomican
  • 8,402 posts

Posted 27 September 2017 - 05:12 PM

...But still, the walking on eggshells is just so blatant at times.  FFS, the Klingons on the verge of vapourizing them and they're worried about respecting their "customs"...

Somewhat (!) off-topic and will probably end up going to Hell in a handcart for this, but seriously pondering translating "Klingon" to "Muslim"...  


Anything not nailed down is mine, and anything I can prise up is not nailed down...

#12 Rybags

Rybags

    Immortal

  • Super Hero
  • 35,058 posts

Posted 27 September 2017 - 05:32 PM

For sure... but I suppose it is Star Trek and it's virtually always been a vehicle of the idealism of the day.

 

Just in this case it seems to overshadow just about everything else going on.



#13 @~thehung

@~thehung

    Guru

  • Hero
  • 8,638 posts

Posted 27 September 2017 - 06:17 PM

spoilers for something like Star Trek?    i guess ive never associated it with plot twists and big reveals that could be spoiled.  well, i suppose there were some killer TNG and Voyager eps that couldve been ruined.  but the joy of those shows was in seeing how the team approached a problem — ie. it was mostly in the process itself, which is largely unspoilerable.

 

 

i dunno, the whole franchise seems old hat to me now.   it always verged on the intolerably twee, and lacked any balls.  i do want something with a large dose of idealism, but i dont know if i can go back to that.  and whilst the JJ Abrams shit has more verve, its flashy and trashy, and lacking in brains.  so i am finding it hard to muster any enthusiasm for this.


no pung intended

#14 Rybags

Rybags

    Immortal

  • Super Hero
  • 35,058 posts

Posted 27 September 2017 - 06:42 PM

The franchise has a lot of value but that counts against it in a way.  At least it's not gone the ridiculous path of Terminator (yet).  But the reboot and rewriting of accepted history has been annoying this last 15 years.

Personally I'd have preferred if they'd not had Ent and continued the existing storyline with something like "Academy" - even if it did mean something like Wesley Crusher as an SFA professor.



#15 i_am_banned2

i_am_banned2

    Primarch

  • Atomican
  • 1,689 posts

Posted 27 September 2017 - 08:39 PM

 

Crew of USS Discovery:


Either you are joking, or you have never watched any version of Star Trek. I'm assuming the former, but the internet has shown me things you people would never believe. ;p

 

 

As silly as it is, my post was heavily inspired by some real discussions happening on Star Trek fan forums.
 
 
My actual thoughts on the prologue (first two episodes):
 
- High production values, everything looks great.
 
- Some pacing issues, clunky writing, and poor dialogue (all pretty standard for a Trek series, though, to be fair).
 
- Characterisation is pretty bland for what appears to be a story-driven narrative.
 
 
It's only the beginning of the series, though. There's some good ideas and the Federation-Klingon War (*SPOILER!*) should be interesting to watch. However, if they fail to breathe life into any of the characters over the next couple of episodes I'll struggle to stick with it.


#16 Rybags

Rybags

    Immortal

  • Super Hero
  • 35,058 posts

Posted 27 September 2017 - 09:41 PM

The casting to me seems like they're diversity target try-hards.

 

I suppose we should bring TNG in - at the time it started Levar Burton (LaForge) was probably the highest profile actor, previously being on Roots, and I think Gates McFadden and Michael Dorn had a few minor parts on serial dramas (ignoring John DeLancy who was not a regular but was very well known at the time from his long run on Days of Our Lives).

 

Just whether the character development occurs I agree might mean whether the show lives or dies.  IMO Patrick Stewart almost solely kept TNG afloat during the dud eps on the first 2 years, though the attribution there is probably way more towards acting quality than character development.  ST: Ent was a fail IMO because it lacked both.



#17 Cybes

Cybes

    Titan

  • Atomican
  • 18,054 posts
  • Location:Where I am

Posted 27 September 2017 - 10:18 PM

ST: Ent was a fail IMO because it lacked both.


...True. Trekkies will stand for an awful lot of bullshit if there's just the rare flower, though, which is why it lasted as long as it did (4 years?). IMHO, what killed it stone dead was Scott Dracula Bakula. That plank of wood would lose an acting contest to Keanu Reeves - he has not been in anything that lasted since Quantum Leap, and that one was kept in spite of him by interesting stories.


"Reality does not care what you think." - Dr Richard Feynman
"There is no "I" in team." - "True.  I will not be found in any team."


#18 i_am_banned2

i_am_banned2

    Primarch

  • Atomican
  • 1,689 posts

Posted 27 September 2017 - 10:31 PM

The casting to me seems like they're diversity target try-hards.

 

I suppose we should bring TNG in - at the time it started Levar Burton (LaForge) was probably the highest profile actor, previously being on Roots, and I think Gates McFadden and Michael Dorn had a few minor parts on serial dramas (ignoring John DeLancy who was not a regular but was very well known at the time from his long run on Days of Our Lives).

 

Just whether the character development occurs I agree might mean whether the show lives or dies.  IMO Patrick Stewart almost solely kept TNG afloat during the dud eps on the first 2 years, though the attribution there is probably way more towards acting quality than character development.  ST: Ent was a fail IMO because it lacked both.

 

Doesn't bother me either way, as far as casting diversity goes. Black, alien, transgender, whatever - all that stuff is of little significance compared to overall personality and actions. Picard isn't much-loved merely because he's white and a man, after all. He'd be just as popular if, all else being the same, the character was Asian and a woman. Having a "diverse" cast (ie. not all white men), though, has always been a theme of Star Trek - and sci-fi in general. Sexuality is just another facet of that but similarly doesn't substitute for proper characterisation by itself.

 

ST:TNG was certainly carried heavily by Patrick Stewart, but also had an easier time due to its episodic nature. The characters themselves were less important than the fanciful tale being told, from start to finish, during the length of a single episode. ST:D (unfortunate acronym) is going for a series-long story arc instead so character development will be critical to its success. There's huge potential here: could be the best Trek series ever, or the worst.

 

I haven't seen ST:E, so can't comment on that one.



#19 eveln

eveln

    Guru

  • Atomican
  • 16,381 posts
  • Location:Nth QLD

Posted 27 September 2017 - 10:33 PM

Even Patrick's delivery could not sustain us / me over the consistent use of the holo-deck to make the story for most of the latter episodes. As with most long running shows the writers get stale. Scott and his dog that seemed to live permanently in Scott's tiny cell of a room annoyed me rather a lot. Such total lack of proper care for the animal !


 Laugh to Live . Live to Laugh.

atomic has π


#20 Rybags

Rybags

    Immortal

  • Super Hero
  • 35,058 posts

Posted 27 September 2017 - 11:23 PM

Dog?  TNG had Data's cat Spot as the only recurring animal that I recall.  The hilarious thing though is that they fucked up and we ended up with a transgender cat.

 

The writing in TNG - IMO some of the best episodes were in the last series.  Examples being Descent 2, Gambit (2 parts), Parallels, Pegasus, Lower Decks, Genesis, Preemptive Strike and All Good Things.  9 outstanding from a series of 25 isn't too bad.

At the other end, you'd be hard pressed to find 9 decent episodes in the first 3 years (OK, I'll give it a go).

 

Series 1 - The Naked Now, Where no-one has Gone Before, Datalore.

Series 2 - Contagion, Time Squared, Q Who.

Series 3 - Booby Trap, The Enemy, Yesterday's Enterprise, Hollow Pursuits, Best of Both Worlds 1.

 

 

OK, I found 11 and this is going on distant memory but IMO the heyday of TNG was the end of S3 right through till the end.  One of few serialised TV shows without a jumping the shark moment.






0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users