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Ghost_Bear

So... Who's Playing Eve-online?

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what, and you want to cheap out on 40 bucks for the opportunity to train them? it isn't that bad.

 

you want to do something to make your play time better, but not pay for it? don't be a cheapskate

Obviously that's a no, you dont. When it gets to that end of things spending a month to train ONE skill is tedious considering they're generally only being trained so you can use something else. I really dont see why they needed to change the old system, and that's my final 2/100th's of a dollar

 

 

im training a 24 day skill right now, but instead of trying to get something for free, i go and run a mission or 2, and do some pvp with friends, god forbid you should pay to use a feature of a game that is pay to play

 

ive trained three 24 day skills. i didnt ghost train one of them. it costs, what, $50 for three months? i could afford that on pocket money, stop bitching about the price, its a stupid argument unless you happen to live in a cardboard box.

 

im using CCP's server, and their electricity. i owe them money.

 

So if you decided to end you sub for example like I did, and say, had 20 days to go on the skill and 1 day left before your time expired you'd prefer to have to train for 19 days once you got back rather than have it tick over while you were doing something else?

But hey its you and woot who have titan sized cocks rammed up yer arses about it. I just found it an annoying decision on ccps part since it worked fine for the last 4 years or so.

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Both sides have good points.

 

It's no cost to them to let you ghost train skills. I assume that when you set a skill for training, it adds it to the database as your currently training skill and then everytime you load up the game again, it checks how long it has been since you started that skill and presumably updates the server with your new skill points.

 

Between this, and the new GTC's which are worse value for money, it does seem like CCP are trying to get more money together.

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It still doesn't change the fact they are stopping freeloaders from not paying to advance their character. This is a good thing.

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It still doesn't change the fact they are stopping freeloaders from not paying to advance their character. This is a good thing.

That's why I said both sides have points :)

There's no loss to CCP for allowing freeloaders to do so though, and they might find people give EVE up because of it.

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So if you decided to end you sub for example like I did, and say, had 20 days to go on the skill and 1 day left before your time expired you'd prefer to have to train for 19 days once you got back rather than have it tick over while you were doing something else?

But hey its you and woot who have titan sized cocks rammed up yer arses about it. I just found it an annoying decision on ccps part since it worked fine for the last 4 years or so.

well if i didn't pay for the time, i wouldn't expect to train the skill, simple as that.

 

you want to train that 19 days? pay for it.

 

it's like expecting to pay for one drink at a pub, then wanting the next one free

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it's like expecting to pay for one drink at a pub, then wanting the next one free

Except that having a drink at a pub costs the pub money for every drink.

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it's like expecting to pay for one drink at a pub, then wanting the next one free

Except that having a drink at a pub costs the pub money for every drink.

 

 

and maintaining a character database is free for CCP? server for knowing who is training what doesn't take electricity? Do you expect the guys at CCP to give the game for free?

 

 

The basic gist of this is, ghost training = people wanting to utilize game features, while not currently paying to do so.

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I think you've misunderstood how ghost training works?

 

Basically, your character information isn't deleted. It will be maintained regardless of whether you are currently subscribed or not.

Previously, they'd leave a skill training as a record. Now, they delete the record, but obviously not the character data. For the DB to be optimised properly, the data will be maintained and not completely erased, it will just be a section of null data so it'll still take up the same space as having a skill training would.

 

What does that mean in terms of cost for CCP? Nothing. It's essentially a way of trying to get people who ghost to pay for those time periods. Instead, it's likely to turn a lot of people away.

 

The database itself keeps information regardless of whether you are training or not. Adding in the bit about your training adds nothing to the server load because of the way training works. That's why it was possible to ghost train in the first place.

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I think you've misunderstood how ghost training works?

 

Basically, your character information isn't deleted. It will be maintained regardless of whether you are currently subscribed or not.

Previously, they'd leave a skill training as a record. Now, they delete the record, but obviously not the character data. For the DB to be optimised properly, the data will be maintained and not completely erased, it will just be a section of null data so it'll still take up the same space as having a skill training would.

 

What does that mean in terms of cost for CCP? Nothing. It's essentially a way of trying to get people who ghost to pay for those time periods. Instead, it's likely to turn a lot of people away.

 

The database itself keeps information regardless of whether you are training or not. Adding in the bit about your training adds nothing to the server load because of the way training works. That's why it was possible to ghost train in the first place.

Amen to that

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"I think you've misunderstood how ghost training works?"

 

no, i think you've misunderstood how money is made from a game that is pay to play - person pays to do thing, person gets to do thing. this move should have been made sooner

why should they let you train your character, while NOT paying them for it? the account is lapsed, not considered active, you ARE NOT PAYING, they don't owe you anything.

 

 

Power bills - don't pay, don't get electricity

phone bill - don't pay, don't get phone

 

etc, etc, etc ad infinitum.

 

 

it may have been a feature of the game, who gives a rats, it isn't anymore, and nobody is forcing you to play. For example, i played WoW, dailies are shit, repetitive grind is shit, i didn't complain, i just stopped playing and paying them.

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Wow, angry much?

 

If you want to compare it to something, compare it to the atomic website.

Even if you don't post, it still holds your post count.

 

That is what it is similar to. It is in no way similar to power bills, or phone bills.

I've said repeatedly that I understand where you are coming from, but you seem to lack the empathy to see the other side. Incidently, you don't happen to be the guy that joined the atomic channel, talked about mining in a Rohk, got told off by subs (of all people), and then left again? Just curious, because he was angry and couldn't empathise too =P It's not a bad thing, but it's sure nice when you're able to see both sides of the arguements instead of being blinded by what you percieve to be as "freeloading".

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Wow, angry much?

 

If you want to compare it to something, compare it to the atomic website.

Even if you don't post, it still holds your post count.

 

That is what it is similar to. It is in no way similar to power bills, or phone bills.

I've said repeatedly that I understand where you are coming from, but you seem to lack the empathy to see the other side. Incidently, you don't happen to be the guy that joined the atomic channel, talked about mining in a Rohk, got told off by subs (of all people), and then left again? Just curious, because he was angry and couldn't empathise too =P It's not a bad thing, but it's sure nice when you're able to see both sides of the arguements instead of being blinded by what you percieve to be as "freeloading".

what other side is there? honestly, why on earth should they allow people to train a skill, to further their account, when that person is not paying them? i don't understand why it's such a big issue for the people who do it, because it's just common sense. it might cost them nothing, who cares, but it's also freeloading.

 

As I remember things (mining Rokh), not being able to empathise is different to having the shit bagged out of you for even bringing the topic up. i merely left the wankers to their own devices :) i accept they have a different view, but being a fucktard when somebody asks about something is just stupid.

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Has anyone stated yet that "The ability to further train skills without an active subscription" was pedaled by CCP themselves as a feature of the game for 5 years before 3 days ago? Check their playerguide, unless they ninja edited it.

 

That's what has pissed so many people off.

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Has anyone stated yet that "The ability to further train skills without an active subscription" was pedaled by CCP themselves as a feature of the game for 5 years before 3 days ago? Check their playerguide, unless they ninja edited it.

 

That's what has pissed so many people off.

 

THIS

 

THIS is what i was waiting for, this is why i know people are pissed off.

 

However, CCP own the product and can change it however they like - don't like it? don't play it

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I'll be playing it, but I won't be paying.

 

I was having more fun with dozens of trial accounts.

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After 3 of my mates reactivated their accounts and joined the corp my mate has just become director of... im giving serious thought to rejoining.

Do it.

I'm loving EVE :D

 

yeah, i loved EVE too...

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So if you decided to end you sub for example like I did, and say, had 20 days to go on the skill and 1 day left before your time expired you'd prefer to have to train for 19 days once you got back rather than have it tick over while you were doing something else?

But hey its you and woot who have titan sized cocks rammed up yer arses about it. I just found it an annoying decision on ccps part since it worked fine for the last 4 years or so.

i play EVE every day. your question is therefore invalid, i renew my sub when its about to run out.

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So if you decided to end you sub for example like I did, and say, had 20 days to go on the skill and 1 day left before your time expired you'd prefer to have to train for 19 days once you got back rather than have it tick over while you were doing something else?

But hey its you and woot who have titan sized cocks rammed up yer arses about it. I just found it an annoying decision on ccps part since it worked fine for the last 4 years or so.

i play EVE every day. your question is therefore invalid, i renew my sub when its about to run out.

 

You also pirate many games. You are playing something and not paying for it. Now theres some fine grade hypocrisy. Your argument is therefore invalid.

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I can see why people are pissed but I also dont understand why it was ever a feature. It just encourages people to break subscriptions. I'm guessing it's mainly used by people with multiple accounts. Playing one while the other is out of sub training some level 5 skill. Maybe a better move on CCPs part would have been to leave it in place but make the training speed slower. Maybe remove learning and implant bonuses or cut it to half the rate. That way it would encourage 'power gamers' to maintain their subs but it would still give something to the casual players that might take a break when the sub lapsed.

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So if you decided to end you sub for example like I did, and say, had 20 days to go on the skill and 1 day left before your time expired you'd prefer to have to train for 19 days once you got back rather than have it tick over while you were doing something else?

But hey its you and woot who have titan sized cocks rammed up yer arses about it. I just found it an annoying decision on ccps part since it worked fine for the last 4 years or so.

i play EVE every day. your question is therefore invalid, i renew my sub when its about to run out.

 

You also pirate many games. You are playing something and not paying for it. Now theres some fine grade hypocrisy. Your argument is therefore invalid.

 

i can count the number of games ive pirated on my fingers, actually. you got completely the wrong idea from that thread, you tend to pick out the points that support your view and ignore the rest, thats why it comes and hits you in the face later, like now ;)

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It just encourages people to break subscriptions.

I think the exact opposite.

 

It encourages people to have multiple accounts, and it ends up being more money managing multiple accounts (even when they are ghost training for periods) then it does having a single account.

In addition, it provides people with a reason to come back. They get frustrated, set a long skill, and leave. Months go by, then they go "My BS V should be done by now heh." and come back to EVE. That's what a heap of people I know have done.

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I actually had a really good rebuttal to Substances "I only pirate a few games so because i cannot communicate well you fail" but it'd be wasted on him. It's like trying to explain the fundamentals of nuclear physics to a turnip, except the turnip would eventually get it. Yet people wonder why I take breaks from eve...

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It just encourages people to break subscriptions.

I think the exact opposite.

 

Err to ghost train you had to break your sub, but I agree with the rest of what you said.

 

I'm new to EVE but experience in other games suggests that multiple accounts etc is more likely to be driven by obsession and the difference between paying for 2 subs a years verses 1.7 subs a year wont be the deciding factor in whether they get another account.

 

I agree it's an encouragement to come back to the game. That's why I suggested some sort of research time penalty could have been a better option as the lvl5 skill would still be done after a few months away.

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It just encourages people to break subscriptions.

I think the exact opposite.

 

Err to ghost train you had to break your sub, but I agree with the rest of what you said.

 

I'm new to EVE but experience in other games suggests that multiple accounts etc is more likely to be driven by obsession and the difference between paying for 2 subs a years verses 1.7 subs a year wont be the deciding factor in whether they get another account.

 

I agree it's an encouragement to come back to the game. That's why I suggested some sort of research time penalty could have been a better option as the lvl5 skill would still be done after a few months away.

 

i think a penalty might have been a better idea. that said, it looks like the removal of ghost training will hvae a positive effect as well. whenever someone has suggested a skill queue, CCP has said no on the basis that people will use it while ghost training. with that gone, there is an epic push to have a skill queue introduced, and CCP doesnt really have a viable reason to say no.

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Jesus you all need to HTFU.

 

Who fucking cares if someone is training a skill while they're not paying their sub?

 

I took a break for Tafe, and yeah I left a month long skill going.

The fact that you could in Eve was awesome.

 

It breaks down the gap between the hardcore players and the really casual players like myself.

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