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witcher01

Windows 8 Information ?

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...what's with the whole having to log in to an MSN account to get the full use of it?

You fucking what?

 

I was not going to buy it just because the UI is horrible, but I probably would have put up with it through laziness when I upgraded hardware next. That bit of news, otoh, is going to finalise my move to linux. (Already had a few plays with it, but it wasn't ready for prime time yet, imo, when compared to W7.)

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Sorry I haven't read the whole thread, but when are we roughly expecting this? I want to upgrade, but I don't want to buy W7 for my desktop if W8 is going to be released late this year or early next year.

Some places are now offering the Win 8 upgrade offer.

http://windows.microsoft.com/en-AU/windows/upgrade-offer

Frankly I am totally underwhelmed by the UI, I think it is bloody horrible.

I even had to fucking Google to find the goddam shutdown button, plus what's with the whole having to log in to an MSN account to get the full use of it? The fuck is with that bullshit? What happens if you currently have no internet available or have a network adapter that requires 3rd party drivers, or need to enter proxies or fixed IPs to get a connection?

 

uhhhhhhhhh

For a start you don't have to use an MSN account, you can create an account just like you do in Vista/7.

You can also merge the local account with an MSN account if you want, but it makes you use the password of that account to log in.

Once they are merged/created you don't need an internet connection to log in.

 

I do agree that the UI is broken, it seems the teams did not communicate when designing it..

Seems to be the decade to throw 30 years of GUI development out the window...

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Microsoft: You Are the Reason Why We Killed the Start Menu

You're the reason why Microsoft yanked our beloved Start button out of Windows. For shame.

 

One of the big negative issues surrounding the upcoming release of Windows 8 is the lack of a Start button, one of the standard Windows-based features we've used since the release of Windows 95. It was assumed that Microsoft ditched the familiar tool in order to force users into accepting the new Metro interface. Heck, Microsoft event went so far as to remove code from the OS that would have enabled a third-party Start button.

 

But now Microsoft is blaming the actual consumer for its removal. Chaitanya Sareen, principal program manager at Microsoft, said during TechEd in Amsterdam that users began to fall out of favor for the Start button in Windows 7, preferring to pin their favorite applications to the taskbar instead. This observation was based on telemetry gathered by the Microsoft Customer Experience Improvement Program.

 

"We’d seen the trend in Windows 7," Sareen told PC Pro. "When we evolved the taskbar we saw awesome adoption of pinning [applications] on the taskbar. We are seeing people pin like crazy. And so we saw the Start menu usage dramatically dropping, and that gave us an option. We’re saying 'look, Start menu usage is dropping, what can we do about it? What can we do with the Start menu to revive it, to give it some new identity, give it some new power?'"

 

"So I’m a desktop user, I pin the browser, Explorer, whatever my apps are. I don’t go the Start menu as often," he added. "If you’re going to the Start screen now, we’re going to unlock a whole new set of scenarios, or you can choose not to go there, stay in the desktop, and it’s still fast. You can’t beat the taskbar."

 

Sareen also said that Windows 7 users are taking advantage of keyboard shortcuts to open applications rather than digging them out from the Start menu. For instance, by pressing the Windows Key and "1" once Internet Explorer is pinned to the taskbar, the browser loads. It's not as quick as simply clicking on the icon pinned to the taskbar, but it's quicker than digging through the Start menu.

 

In addition to talking about the lack of a Start button, she also reportedly dismissed complaints about how the Metro interface is more focused on touch-based devices than the desktops and laptops that make up the majority of Microsoft's business. Even two Microsoft presenters were struggling to make gesture controls work on laptop trackpads during the show.

 

According to Sareen, the touchpad drivers were still "very, very early" and were "still being refined." He also said the Metro interface "really works well with the mouse and keyboard."

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... users began to fall out of favor for the Start button in Windows 7, preferring to pin their favorite applications to the taskbar instead.

This is true. Of course, that wouldn't have anything at all to do with the start menu being completely useless in W7.

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Also the fact they want everyone running Metro apps where the get 30% of the profits might be a motive...

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Ooo, Windows 8 includes, for the first time, proper italic and italic bold versions of Comic Sans MS!

 

Fuck yeah! Installing!

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Ooo, Windows 8 includes, for the first time, proper italic and italic bold versions of Comic Sans MS!

 

Fuck yeah! Installing!

Ten year old schoolkids and middelaged housewives who make flyers, rejoice!

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Upgrade to Windows 8 Pro for $39.99!

 

I was completely uninterested in Windows 8. 7 does the job for me and I was not going to upgrade for a long time, assuming it would cost $200+ locally like previous versions.

 

For $40 though I'm thinking I'll give it a go on launch day. Good to see Microsoft taking notice of the adoption rate of low-priced new versions of OS X and trying the same thing. Cheap upgrades ftw!

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It's still $40 too much given there's absolutely nothing that helps productivity.

Actively gets in the way of it, if you're talking about Metro.

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It's still $40 too much given there's absolutely nothing that helps productivity.

Actively gets in the way of it, if you're talking about Metro.

 

Quote from 1965: "Fucking mechanical tabulator, actively gets in the way of productivity."

Quote from 1985: "Fucking graphical UI, actively gets in the way of productivity."

Quote from 1995: "Fucking Start Menu, actively gets in the way of productivity."

 

UI overhauls are nothing new. Everybody always says the same thing.

Edited by SquallStrife

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Quote from 1965: "Fucking mechanical tabulator, actively gets in the way of productivity."

Quote from 1985: "Fucking graphical UI, actively gets in the way of productivity."

Quote from 1995: "Fucking Start Menu, actively gets in the way of productivity."

 

UI overhauls are nothing new. Everybody always says the same thing.

I don't know about the 1965 one, but the other two were correct. Swapping from keyboard to mouse does incur a time penalty and therefore result in a productivity loss. Moreover, many people have shit mousing skills, and end up circling the hotspot they're after a time or two before being able to click it.

 

The main issue with Metro is not so much that it's different - people will get over that (as I believe was your argument). The problem is that it's organised in a way that would much better suit portrait screen orientation, when everyone now has widescreens. I don't know about you, but I'm old enough to have seen my screen realestate shrinking, despite resolution improvements, and that's down to everything being rendered with lush-but-fat graphics and poor UI decisions.

 

I turned off Aero the other day because it was causing problems with an old piece of software I had a yen to replay. The amount of extra space I suddenly had was startling.

 

The Metro ribbon is wrong.

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I don't know about the 1965 one, but the other two were correct. Swapping from keyboard to mouse does incur a time penalty and therefore result in a productivity loss. Moreover, many people have shit mousing skills, and end up circling the hotspot they're after a time or two before being able to click it.

Agree...in general GUIs might have a low "bootstrap" time (ie, time to learn) but CLI wins over time.

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I was thinking of testing Windows 8 out just for the hell of it. Has anyone here installed the Release Preview version of it??

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Is it true that Windows8 will be cloud based ? All your settings and profiles will be stored on MS cloud storage they even monitor your usage too. Kinda sounds spooky that MS are taking this path now. Think i will stay with Win7 64bit for now.

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Is it true that Windows8 will be cloud based ? All your settings and profiles will be stored on MS cloud storage they even monitor your usage too. Kinda sounds spooky that MS are taking this path now. Think i will stay with Win7 64bit for now.

You can link it to Microsoft account if you wan't, and it will keep setting synced between computers.

But it is not a requirement to do so, you can still make traditional local accounts.

 

Windows 7 already monitors your usage if you let it btw.

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Having worked in the IT industry 10 years now, I was the same.. very skeptical about Windows 8 and its metro interface. However after using the release preview I can say its actually work pretty good even on mouse and kb.

 

I will be downloading on day 1 (technet sub)

 

Yes there have been claims games dont work (I am a gamer) all you need to do is download dx9 from the MS website and everything runs fine. same thing happened with Windows 7 on release.

Edited by coutts86

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In addition to the above, I took part of using Windows 8 Consumer to Release Preview. In between those two, they definitely made a lot more strides in the keyboard and mouse issue for Metro. Also, Windows 8 actually works very well for mechanical HDDs to the point I thought I was using an SSD! I think the optimisations they made definitely worked.

 

Definitely will upgrade the laptop to Windows 8 when it comes out for the $40 extra.

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Welcome to the world of a mobile OS on a desktop.

 

That said you can close them by going to the task switcher (top left hot corner) and right click > close. Or click and drag down from the top to the bottom of the screen. A little annoying but it is possible. I still prefer the good old little X in the top right corner.

 

The concept is great, but annoying when you have to swap between multiple programs that the OS thinks you still want open.

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Microsoft: You Are the Reason Why We Killed the Start Menu

You're the reason why Microsoft yanked our beloved Start button out of Windows. For shame.

 

One of the big negative issues surrounding the upcoming release of Windows 8 is the lack of a Start button, one of the standard Windows-based features we've used since the release of Windows 95. It was assumed that Microsoft ditched the familiar tool in order to force users into accepting the new Metro interface. Heck, Microsoft event went so far as to remove code from the OS that would have enabled a third-party Start button.

 

But now Microsoft is blaming the actual consumer for its removal. Chaitanya Sareen, principal program manager at Microsoft, said during TechEd in Amsterdam that users began to fall out of favor for the Start button in Windows 7, preferring to pin their favorite applications to the taskbar instead. This observation was based on telemetry gathered by the Microsoft Customer Experience Improvement Program.

 

"We’d seen the trend in Windows 7," Sareen told PC Pro. "When we evolved the taskbar we saw awesome adoption of pinning [applications] on the taskbar. We are seeing people pin like crazy. And so we saw the Start menu usage dramatically dropping, and that gave us an option. We’re saying 'look, Start menu usage is dropping, what can we do about it? What can we do with the Start menu to revive it, to give it some new identity, give it some new power?'"

 

"So I’m a desktop user, I pin the browser, Explorer, whatever my apps are. I don’t go the Start menu as often," he added. "If you’re going to the Start screen now, we’re going to unlock a whole new set of scenarios, or you can choose not to go there, stay in the desktop, and it’s still fast. You can’t beat the taskbar."

 

Sareen also said that Windows 7 users are taking advantage of keyboard shortcuts to open applications rather than digging them out from the Start menu. For instance, by pressing the Windows Key and "1" once Internet Explorer is pinned to the taskbar, the browser loads. It's not as quick as simply clicking on the icon pinned to the taskbar, but it's quicker than digging through the Start menu.

 

In addition to talking about the lack of a Start button, she also reportedly dismissed complaints about how the Metro interface is more focused on touch-based devices than the desktops and laptops that make up the majority of Microsoft's business. Even two Microsoft presenters were struggling to make gesture controls work on laptop trackpads during the show.

 

According to Sareen, the touchpad drivers were still "very, very early" and were "still being refined." He also said the Metro interface "really works well with the mouse and keyboard."

 

 

This is called 'the begining of damage control'.

 

Windows has always been about some modicum of choice. Dont want to use the start button? Fine. But its there if you need to. And sometime you WILL need to. It serves a very particular function. And is more than just about finding an application. It is about having access to your very system.

 

Much like mainstream gaming has now been homogenised by the demands of consoles, what we are seeing in Microsoft is an attempt to create a experience that echoes that of Apple. Whats that you say? Well what I am saying is that like Apple, Microsoft is moving forward with takling AWAY control and customability from the end user and instead providing a homogensied one size fits all experience based on how they want YOU to use things. Its about control. Its about profit. It is NOT about a unique user experience.

 

The irony is that whenever CONTROL is taken away from you (I am think of course of the political sphere as well) the argument as too why this is done is always expressed as being because of "YOU" (you have less privavcy and gurantees of fundamental rights because you demanded to be safer from terrorists for example) When in fact I NEVER asked for those changes. I have always requested CHOICE which is why Windows has always been my OS of choice.

 

 

Disgusting.

 

Windows 8 will be a complete disaster in terms of commercial users. Hell, I work at a Uni and we are still using XP. With plans to migrate to Win 7 maybe next year.

 

I suspect that it will be also a FLOP with private users as well. I can almost 100% guranntee that pre fab desktop and laptop manufacturers will have to start offering 'downgrades' as well for the OS much as they did for Vista.

 

At the end of the day Windows 8 adds absolutely ZERO efficiency and productivity to my life - and indeed after my brief use of it, actually ADDED to my stress and ineeficiency.

 

This is what happens when you get a bunch of Gen Y Apple fanbois and girls to design your products. They cant themselves think outside the concept of 'control', because it is how they have been brought up - this is reflected in all their design.

 

 

PS - BTW Microsoft, I like so many others TURNED off the Customer Improvement Experinece rubbish the moment we finished installing. You data then is based on far more inexperienced users, or at least NOT an adequate representatioon of your users. Which ironically is (if you had any sesne of LOGIC and actuall complexity of thought) should have told you to be even MORE sensistive to the needs of the avergae user - for these people who may pin all their apps to the task bar that doesnt mean that they dont want the Start button!

 

 

Update - just saw this article from the Sydney Morning Herald titled "The Applefication of Microsoft". Seems I'm on the money - http://www.smh.com.au/it-pro/business-it/t...d=1342484895978

Edited by GhostFaceKilla

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