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I recommended two on the previous page. ;)

so much difference betwen the gts450 or the fx600?

 

edit

at least stretch the budget to this case\psu

Antec NSK4482B with EarthWatts 380W $119

Edited by Dasa

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one of the problems is be getting the money for a gpu later, they wont see the need/value after the machine is deployed

 

later on I can wrangle a PSU if it carks (iirc the coolermaster generic PSU's are pretty good)

Integrated video can't handle more one screen so if you want to run two monitors a dedicated GPU is a must then.

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If you compared the two in, say, 3DMark, they'd likely come out similar, the GTS450 would probably even come out ahead.

 

However, Quadro cards support a number of rendering functions and image quality controls not supported by GeForce cards. Faster windowed OpenGL, multiple fully accelerated OpenGL windows, hardware accelerated clipping planes, line antialiasing (not FSAA), etc. They're geared toward graphic work, not playing games.

 

It's apples and oranges, really. You could get away with CAD work on a GeForce/Radeon, but there are better tools available.

 

Integrated video can't handle more one screen so if you want to run two monitors a dedicated GPU is a must then.

The IGP on our Optiplex 990 boxes has one DisplayPort and one VGA port. I didn't even think to try them together, just assumed you could.

 

Do you think it's possible?

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I had a particularily detailed model up on my home machine which is a Q9400, 4gb ram, 60gb ssd and GTX260. When I was experimenting with meshes and expeimenting to get smooth CAM data it took a big hit on the upper end of the triangle range so I think a GPU is needed.

 

 

Might try and stretch it to a better PSU or case/PSU combo but I personally have never had a PSU take out a mobo usually they just fart and die, but I do understand the risks, A UPS will be in use aswel.

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The IGP on our Optiplex 990 boxes has one DisplayPort and one VGA port. I didn't even think to try them together, just assumed you could.

 

Do you think it's possible?

 

 

Works fine I run 2x22" monitors at work on them.

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The IGP on our Optiplex 990 boxes has one DisplayPort and one VGA port. I didn't even think to try them together, just assumed you could.

 

Do you think it's possible?

 

 

Works fine I run 2x22" monitors at work on them.

 

OK, I'm wrong then about the new Intel IGPs or the HP workstations I buy only ship with one VGA port anyway to save money ...

Edited by Jeruselem

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Perhaps some enterprise level hardware may be better suited to this if only for the support factor, such as a Dell optiplex or precision workstation?

 

Like I don't work in a corporate role but if I was I wouldn't want some random on my project team making the computer that we rely on to run the CNC machine which we depend on for our livelyhood.

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Perhaps some enterprise level hardware may be better suited to this if only for the support factor, such as a Dell optiplex or precision workstation?

 

Like I don't work in a corporate role but if I was I wouldn't want some random on my project team making the computer that we rely on to run the CNC machine which we depend on for our livelyhood.

 

What about if that random was the person who built the CNC machine?

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Im trying to spec you a machine right now, but finding a motherboard that supports ECC ram is fucking hard.

 

I can go a server board, but thats $400+, and not budget worthy.

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Perhaps some enterprise level hardware may be better suited to this if only for the support factor, such as a Dell optiplex or precision workstation?

 

Like I don't work in a corporate role but if I was I wouldn't want some random on my project team making the computer that we rely on to run the CNC machine which we depend on for our livelyhood.

 

What about if that random was the person who built the CNC machine?

 

So its all pretty low end then I guess you can do what you want but your bosses will be pissed when you tell them you have to send say the motherboard away for 4 weeks when it dies, better to have dell come and replace it then and there is all I am saying because remember redundancy is only as good as the weakest part and alot of the hardware being suggested here IMO is not going to be that relliable.

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Perhaps some enterprise level hardware may be better suited to this if only for the support factor, such as a Dell optiplex or precision workstation?

 

Like I don't work in a corporate role but if I was I wouldn't want some random on my project team making the computer that we rely on to run the CNC machine which we depend on for our livelyhood.

 

What about if that random was the person who built the CNC machine?

 

Also, if you've employed him, he's not 'some random'.

 

And if the employer is smart, he'll know a 'hand built' system ends up better value.

 

He'll know it has longer service life as you can upgrade ALL parts at any time (even if you require second hand) because it wont have a special shaped case, PSU, or otherwise.

 

He'll know that as long as its not 'manufacturer warranty only' he could phone "johns PC repair, around the corner" without voiding hardware warranties, unlike a 'brand' system.

 

And he'll know that if its custom built with a parts list, even if the 'random' is fired, he has a full parts list to provide his new tech.

 

 

Pre-builts are fantastic for 1 thing.

WARRANTY

If you dont need to call and wait on DELL\HP\ETC, why would you bother?

If you're a smart employer you'll know your employees skill-sets and use them.

 

Perhaps some enterprise level hardware may be better suited to this if only for the support factor, such as a Dell optiplex or precision workstation?

 

Like I don't work in a corporate role but if I was I wouldn't want some random on my project team making the computer that we rely on to run the CNC machine which we depend on for our livelyhood.

 

What about if that random was the person who built the CNC machine?

 

So its all pretty low end then I guess you can do what you want but your bosses will be pissed when you tell them you have to send say the motherboard away for 4 weeks when it dies, better to have dell come and replace it then and there is all I am saying because remember redundancy is only as good as the weakest part and alot of the hardware being suggested here IMO is not going to be that relliable.

 

Thats my point:

"Hello DELL? Please come and replace my motherboard.... 48 Hours? So we cant do ANY work for 48 hours?"

 

and I know for a fact, working government where we use Hp and DELL equally, their "24 hour onsite support" applies to the first visit, which is a look and diagnose only.

 

My old boss was MUCH happier when one of the PC's died, i told him I could have it up and running again within half an hour.

New mobo; safe mode; install new drivers; done.

 

 

EDIT: finding a motherboard that supports ECC ram is going to blow your budget, and despite my rant, a cheap server which you add to may be the better option.

 

If you go non-ECC you'll be fine. PhenomII's and above support ECC, and the ram is cheap, its just the board which is hard to locate.

Edited by Master_Scythe

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If you're a smart employer you'll know your employees skill-sets and use them.

If you're a smarter employer, you don't run a shop that stops work because one computer fails. You shove the HDD in a spare machine, and keep on truckin. If you're a small business, you can't afford to rest your laurels on "this one guy we have that knows a bit about computers".

 

"Hello DELL? Please come and replace my motherboard.... 48 Hours? So we cant do ANY work for 48 hours?"

When a Dell part here fails, the replacement part is delivered by courier the same day, or early the next day.

 

But you don't have to wait for that part to arrive, because you keep spare machines onsite to use as surrogates.

 

and I know for a fact, working government where we use Hp and DELL equally, their "24 hour onsite support" applies to the first visit, which is a look and diagnose only.

Then get a better CSR at Dell. We get same- or early next-business-day parts without a site visit.

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This PC is the development computer, the data will be exported to a laptop built into the CNC machine, so if this goes down it is not going to stop the machine from running.

 

If the laptop goes down then it will be a matter of replacing the laptop and loading the contoller software on the new laptop and we are away again.

 

I am currently developing the system, CAD drawings and database on my own i7 Acer 1830T lappy and it is a bit much to ask me to manage an entire manufacturing process on an ultraportable lappy.

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Sorry Squall, but welcome to the real world.

 

Not many businesses have that kind of spare money to keep a redundant machine sitting around. Not even the Queensland Government has that sort of money spare (we have 0 spare machines).

 

Only middle-large provate businesses can throw it around like that.

 

Also, re:dell, we use both direct call logging via their corporate report system, and Data3; both dat at least a whole day to get to us. MUCH longer than a 5 minute walk down the street to the local PC store.

 

 

I agree, its ideal, but not realistic of most business.

 

 

EDIT: Betzie, how set are you on ECC ram? Grab a cheap dell server and add to it, if you're sure you want it (it is a nice feature)...

 

EDIT AGAIN: Even DELL's cheap low end servers dont use ECC ram. This makes life hard. Up the budget or forget ECC it seems.

Anyone have a mobo solution?

Edited by Master_Scythe

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I use a HP XW4600 with ECC RAM (which is rather expensive). I can't see how it's making my Windows 7 run any better anyway.

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I'm well aware of the "real world" you speak of, and quite frankly, most people are "doing it wrong".

 

For the boomers and older Gen Y's that are running small businesses these days, IT is still an afterthought. They spend bare minimum amounts of money on IT, because it's something they don't understand, and usually don't want to understand. They'd prefer not to think about things like disaster recovery, because "Oh that'll just cost money".

 

A good boss recognises the importance of things like backups and spare equipment.

Edited by SquallStrife

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I'm well aware of the "real world" you speak of, and quite frankly, most people are "doing it wrong".

 

For the boomers and older Gen Y's that are running small businesses these days, IT is still an afterthought. They spend bare minimum amounts of money on IT, because it's something they don't understand, and usually don't want to understand. They'd prefer not to think about things like disaster recovery, because "Oh that'll just cost money".

 

A good boss recognises the importance of things like backups and spare equipment.

Backups; yep, agree.

 

Spare equipment? Nah.

I still stand by the belief; a piece of equipment I can replace within half an hour with a quick drive to the shops, is better than a warranty I have to wait on at risk of voiding other things.

 

As for a full spare? You're literally doubling your IT inventory, its wise, but unrealistic.

 

Even enterprise servers dont OFTEN have full redundancy, usually just PSu and HDD.

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As for a full spare? You're literally doubling your IT inventory, its wise, but unrealistic.

Nonsense, you'd have a spare machine for, say up to 10? Maybe a handful of HDDs and optical drives, the things that fail most frequently.

 

When a machine fails, you swap in your spare, and organise warranty in the mean time. (Which should be within 24 hours with any decent service agreement)

 

Two of everything is overkill, that's just as irresponsible as having nothing.

 

Even enterprise servers dont OFTEN have full redundancy, usually just PSu and HDD.

Enterprise servers are redundant in other ways though, through technologies like DFS and VM clustering.

Edited by SquallStrife

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Interestingly a different machine which is driven by an old Herbert No 4 Capstan lathe has just had a catastophic failure (the machine is about 4 years old but the Herbert drive unit is 50 years old...)

 

Looks like I will need to build a drive unit for this machine, I will likely use a PLC based variable speed controller with the appropriate clutch and gearbox, but I will select componants that I will be able to improve automation, it will also interface with the PC being discussed.

 

 

Faaark I need some help, to many things to sort out and no one to bloody share the load..

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I think the key is choosing the right service support.

 

We choose Dells laptops because Dell send a tech within 48 hours to fix the laptop and most of the time it's done properly.

We used to use Toshiba laptops but the time taken to fix one laptop took bloody weeks.

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I think the key is choosing the right service support.

 

We choose Dells laptops because Dell send a tech within 48 hours to fix the laptop and most of the time it's done properly.

We used to use Toshiba laptops but the time taken to fix one laptop took bloody weeks.

heh, we have the exact opposite experience.

 

Dumped dell for up to a fortnight of hearing nothing, and toshiba are there, same day, every time, with a full part-kit. Fixing ANYTHING on site.

 

Just depends where you are eh?

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I think the key is choosing the right service support.

 

We choose Dells laptops because Dell send a tech within 48 hours to fix the laptop and most of the time it's done properly.

We used to use Toshiba laptops but the time taken to fix one laptop took bloody weeks.

heh, we have the exact opposite experience.

 

Dumped dell for up to a fortnight of hearing nothing, and toshiba are there, same day, every time, with a full part-kit. Fixing ANYTHING on site.

 

Just depends where you are eh?

 

Weird

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Dumped dell for up to a fortnight of hearing nothing, and toshiba are there, same day, every time, with a full part-kit. Fixing ANYTHING on site.

It's down to the individual CSR, and how big your account is.

Edited by SquallStrife

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Dumped dell for up to a fortnight of hearing nothing, and toshiba are there, same day, every time, with a full part-kit. Fixing ANYTHING on site.

It's down to the individual CSR, and how big your account is.

 

Yep.

 

Never had an issue with Dell. In fact, even if I breathe down the phone, they'll bend over backwards.

 

Though from this entire thread, I realise why people don't want to hire gen y IT staff. They clearly think they'll get some gen y retard who will just build a fullsik gamin rig yo.

Edited by brains

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