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strifus

NBN in trouble?

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See, when I read about the NBN before it started rolling out, what he's proposing, was the INITIAL proposal.

Fiber to the exchanges, or even to the distribution boxes, then short runs of copper.

Guaranteeing Australia 25mbps sync ADSL2 to every home that can get a normal telephone line.

 

Honestly? I'll be happy with whatever improvement is made over normal ADSL2 now. As long as they dont stop entirely, whatever.

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it's biggest hurdle maybe the liberal national party.

well, that and the rest of Labor's policies...

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Now that I have cable, anything under 100Mbps is a complete waste of money. FTTH is the only solution which makes sense since it can guarantee high speeds and scalability down the line. Do it properly, do it once.

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Now that I have cable, anything under 100Mbps is a complete waste of money. FTTH is the only solution which makes sense since it can guarantee high speeds and scalability down the line. Do it properly, do it once.

+1

 

2Mbps upload speed though, that's a bit cheesy.

Edited by SquallStrife

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Now that I have cable, anything under 100Mbps is a complete waste of money. FTTH is the only solution which makes sense since it can guarantee high speeds and scalability down the line. Do it properly, do it once.

+1

 

2Mbps upload speed though, that's a bit cheesy.

 

Yeah bloody Telstra, there's no technical reason for why it's that low.

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Fiber to the exchanges, or even to the distribution boxes, then short runs of copper.

Guaranteeing Australia 25mbps sync ADSL2 to every home that can get a normal telephone line.

I'm not really sure what you mean by distribution boxes, but, er, isn't this how it is currently? Each exchange and sub-exchange has backhaul provided by fibre?

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Now that I have cable, anything under 100Mbps is a complete waste of money. FTTH is the only solution which makes sense since it can guarantee high speeds and scalability down the line. Do it properly, do it once.

That is pretty much the reason I posted the link in the first place. To be honest, I agree with CG here on this. Do it once and do it properly.

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Fiber to the exchanges, or even to the distribution boxes, then short runs of copper.

Guaranteeing Australia 25mbps sync ADSL2 to every home that can get a normal telephone line.

I'm not really sure what you mean by distribution boxes, but, er, isn't this how it is currently? Each exchange and sub-exchange has backhaul provided by fibre?

 

Except that the endpoints can be kilometres away from the node.

 

To get 24Mbps, the modem needs to be 800m or less from the DSLAM.

 

The Telstra Tophats go some way to fixing this, but there is still a lot of work to do.

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Fiber to the exchanges, or even to the distribution boxes, then short runs of copper.

Guaranteeing Australia 25mbps sync ADSL2 to every home that can get a normal telephone line.

I'm not really sure what you mean by distribution boxes, but, er, isn't this how it is currently? Each exchange and sub-exchange has backhaul provided by fibre?

 

Except that the endpoints can be kilometres away from the node.

 

To get 24Mbps, the modem needs to be 800m or less from the DSLAM.

 

The Telstra Tophats go some way to fixing this, but there is still a lot of work to do.

 

Bullshit to the guaranteeing 25Mbit to all Aussies on FTTN. No way will that happen on FTTN even if the nodes are placed close enough to theoretically provide that speed (and no way will that happen). Just a slight degradation in the crappy old copper between node and you and bang down goes your speed.

As far as the nodes go they are bloody big cabinets like

Posted Image

UK Cabinet 4 by cabidas, on Flickr

 

and even in the UK they need cooling fans

Posted Image

UK Cabinet Inside by cabidas, on Flickr

 

So they need power and generally a battery backup in case of power failure. In AU they would most likely need actual aircon units to cool them in most regions.

 

Current estimates are between 50,000 to 70,000 nodes needed for decent urban coverage in Australia. Professor Rod Tucker reckons we would need to build two-to-three small new power station just to power all these nodes. Add to that you still have the massive maintenance costs of all those crappy copper tails.

 

So you can look forward to internet access prices increasing quite markedly if we get lumbered with the obsolescent crap that is FTTN.

 

If they stop the FTTH rollout to go FTTN they will have to renegotiate everything from access to the copper, construction contracts, equipment supplies (IE nodes etc) and god knows what else.

 

So the Coalitions faster cheaper better begins to look bloody sick compared to FTTH. In fact all their claims are just complete bullshit and the only reason they are against it is because Labour started the project, even though the Nationals originally proposed FTTH some years ago.

Funny how the Nationals are now keeping their traps shut about it now isn't it?

A bit more reading for you.

http://www.abc.net.au/technology/articles/.../21/3695094.htm

http://nbnmyths.wordpress.com/why-not-fttn/

 

 

Oh and one more thing against FTTN

Posted Image

UK Cabinet Vandalised by cabidas, on Flickr

Vandalism and battery theft.

Edited by aliali

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aliali: Wasnt there a guy from BT stating exactly that some time ago. Almost all the experts in the field say almost exactly the same thing.

 

The author of the link in the OP does have a point. The LNP cannot allow the passage of the NBN to continue in its current form if it takes government after the next election. It would be political suicide consider what bullshit its spread about FTTP/FTTH over the past few years trying to destroy the ALP's vision of the NBN. To be honest, I dont know how people would vote for it if it became an election issue or a referendum question.

 

EDIT: About to get on a plane home. Thats all for now.

Edited by strifus

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Fiber to the exchanges, or even to the distribution boxes, then short runs of copper.

Guaranteeing Australia 25mbps sync ADSL2 to every home that can get a normal telephone line.

I'm not really sure what you mean by distribution boxes, but, er, isn't this how it is currently? Each exchange and sub-exchange has backhaul provided by fibre?

 

The very first proposal I saw, before ANYTHING was decided was going to have a new piece of hardware installed at every junction spot. For example, I have a cylindrical patch point for phones in my street, which is certainly not a DSLAM, its just to locally patch, what I assume, is alrteady patched at the DSLAM. Like a Krone (bannana plug) panel to a switch patch panel.

Also, if you go far enough out, I was under the impression that rural australia didnt use fibre from the exchange anyway. some had full copper?

 

Kinda irrelivant because it never went ahead. This was just the discussion of it many many years ago now.

Edited by Master_Scythe

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For example, I have a cylindrical patch point for phones in my street

That's what they call the pillar.

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right (knowledge up!).

 

afaik the first thing I saw was suggesting a terminatoin point in every STREET as opposed to every HOME (or was it every road, and not street?). either way it was supposed to make tiny close DSLAMs so you're never below 20mbps. But as I said, never happened, and never even fully proposed after inital discussion it seems.

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right (knowledge up!).

 

afaik the first thing I saw was suggesting a terminatoin point in every STREET as opposed to every HOME (or was it every road, and not street?). either way it was supposed to make tiny close DSLAMs so you're never below 20mbps. But as I said, never happened, and never even fully proposed after inital discussion it seems.

That's fiber-to-the-node. The node is the cabinet that they build at the end of every street, it requires power and active cooling (ie. air conditioning, around 600W worth).

 

It would enable ADSL2+ to be at full speed, because the customer loop is only a few hundred metres tops.

 

In theory, it facilitates other faster DSL variants like VDSL, but it just gives you the same issue on a smaller scale. Houses immediately adjacent to the node get 100Mbps or whatever, roughly every house further away you get, the speed drops dramatically. 100Mbps becomes 90Mbps at the next house, 80 at the next, and so on.

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hey if it can top 10mbps I'll be happy. With the exception of the CBD I only know one person who gets 10mbps or better. lol. I just think brisbane has some very poorly laid out copper.

Wonder what i'll get on my new naked? Ive even built a custom filter for it :D

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I was glad I switched from ADSL2+ to Cable Internet. In South Brisbane I now get a ping of 7ms with download speeds of 36.12 Mbps on current test. However still a limited upload speed of 1.01 Mbps, still better than my ADSL2+ speeds.

 

I don't need the benefits of NBN, but I can see that this country does.

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I was glad I switched from ADSL2+ to Cable Internet. In South Brisbane I now get a ping of 7ms with download speeds of 36.12 Mbps on current test. However still a limited upload speed of 1.01 Mbps, still better than my ADSL2+ speeds.

 

I don't need the benefits of NBN, but I can see that this country does.

South Brisbane exchange area? Then I would have thought you would be on Telstra fibre.

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I was glad I switched from ADSL2+ to Cable Internet. In South Brisbane I now get a ping of 7ms with download speeds of 36.12 Mbps on current test. However still a limited upload speed of 1.01 Mbps, still better than my ADSL2+ speeds.

 

I don't need the benefits of NBN, but I can see that this country does.

keep an eye out for our next meet felow brisbanite.

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Having read the column again, I am disagreeing with it more and more especially about the part where it should be left to market forces to improve. The main point is that if you look at Telstra and Optus alone, in the broadband market sector, especially with regards to HFC, they stopped rolling it out close to a decade ago and if stats are to be believed (only 20% uptake throughout Australia where the HFC network was laid) I can see why it they didn't. I think its clear to most of us that if left up to the market, and for it to make financial sense to roll out FTTP/FTTH, it wouldn't be a stretch to say that the current telcos would probably do nothing till it was too late.

 

But forget about what I just said and think about I from a purely house-owner point of view. Currently, where I live, I hardly use the landline as it is, for 2 reasons. One, because of call centre type advertising and, two, because the connection is so shitty, you cant hear shit most times especially STD/IDD calls. In fact, I have Skype forward my landline calls to my mobile phone. I am sure most of you use mobiles to do most of your calling these days and why wouldn't you, because it costs less than a landline call. Now, consider that we have the possibility that the Coalition is in government after the next election, and I was in the market for home at that time, I would seriously be considering buying a home where the NBN was rolled out the Labor way instead of where the network would be rolled out the Coalition way. Nothing political here, just basic common sense. With the FTTP network, the upgrades would be almost seamless and would take me up to gigabit speeds without batting and eyelid over the next 20 to 30 years. With FTTN, I would have to wait for either market forces or the government to push movement into those speeds which, according to reports its not capable of doing without an upgrade to FTTP.

 

If that's not enough, take a gander at this report. Its frightening.

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