Jump to content
Can't remember your login details? Read more... ×
Master_Scythe

Why so much processing power?

Recommended Posts

So reading the HTC one thread (and arguments there in) I got to thinking.

What do you use your phone for, that needs MORE processing power?

I've made this point before so those who are sick of it, move along

 

For example,

I have a Galaxy Note, underclocked to 900mhz, and undervolted. Running Cyanogenmod. So yeah, its modified, but pretty 'basic' mods.

I have:

I get 2.5 days per charge with moderate use.

15+ tabs open in my browser.

RDP session to home,

mp3 player with thousands+ library of songs,

Spirit-FM-Radio with RDS,

TuneIn Internet Radio.

Email though android mail app; but its buggy.

and plague-inc. for time wasting.

 

 

I was going to compare this to my old E-series, but I thought, no I'm bias to that, as it has QWERTY so its a god to me.... Lets go OLDER!

 

Looking back to 2004, to my ngage (yes, i actually bought one.....) So, some processor with 10's of MB's of spare ram, and what have you :P Lets find out....

http://www.gsmarena.com/nokia_n_gage-390.php

104mhz bitch do you even clock? lol

 

I'd often have 10+ tabs open in Opera.

mp3 player with thousands of song library

FM radio

Internet Radio (though, shoutcast back then)

email through MSN and gmail app.

and a SNES emulator, which has way better games than any casual game IMO (full rpgs for example, or Monkey ball for time wasting)

 

Normally id multitask browsing, music, and MSN.

 

 

Limitations of the old tech for me:

No touch screen, so RDP was shit and I didnt use it after one try.

Browsing was slower, but not a whole load; posisbly 25%?

No HTML5.

No 'universal charger'\USB

 

Things the old tech did better:

Better flash support.

5+ days battery

and ad-hoc wifi gaming with other n-gages (because i'm cool like that. 3D snake battles alone? Lightcycles?)

Email sync was quicker. (odd).

Boot speeds.

Charge time.

 

 

 

ANYWAY my point; is it gaming alone that's driving "high end mobiles"?

If you didn't play games, when would you max out your phone? hell, your previous phone?

 

If a clunky old symbian phone from... wow... 10 years ago (shit!), can have 10 tabs + MSN messenger + MP3 player + SMS messaging, all running at once, with no lag.

 

What are we all using this processing power for?

Hardware advancements are cool, but are people kidding themselves with "I need a faster phone"?

 

My next phone will be the Q5, because qwerty love. But if you say, owned a Galaxy S2, what makes anyone want an S3, or even S4?

Bad wording... want alone I understand... want ENOUGH to spend that much money on it?

 

Not taking sides, I'm just finding it hard to comprehend.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When you think of processing power what we are talking about is the amount of work that can be done by the phone itself. As a really gross generalisation, the more grunt the client, in this case the phone, the more complex the task you can undertake. This can lead to a decrease in the amount of data you need to shunt back and forth.

 

Having a 'smart client' means you can also do more if there is no connectivity.

 

I think you'll find that there are more and more complex apps that require more grunt, and that the underlying OS will also require more processing power as more functionality becomes built in.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I agree, however isnt hardware already WAYYYY above software in this instance?

As the argument was in that HTC thread; the $150 dual core 1ghz phones, vs 4core 'latest and greatest'.

 

I haven't made my mind up :P because clearly my use may be a-typical. but I wouldnt have thought so....

 

I have a semi-modern android device as I said, doing what I thought was typical. If not for 'advanced games' I'm not sure how else I could stress it?

I can even decode 720p on it just fine. Havent had to try 1080.

 

With that said, my 104mhz n-gage could handle 360p just fine :D lol which was above native for it ^~^

Edited by Master_Scythe

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think that phones are at the point now where power is moot. But to answer the question: the same old things, but better. Video calling in 2006 was pretty ugly; two weeks ago using Skype it was awesome! Just using normal apps like navigation, media and web browser is smoother and more repsonsive. Importantly, multitasking is much less prone to stall or crash an application.

 

Apple really pwned Nokia with the 3GS, largely because of hardware. 600MHz/256MB RAM vs. 434MHz/128MB RAM. Plus, iOS 3 was far less feature-rich than S60 5th. The poor N97 Mini was trying to do more with less, and it ended up looking clunky in comparison. Naturally that's not the whole story, and Nokia had to make a decision in order to balance ergonomics, battery life and sheer power. But it was a HUGE mistake to underestimate the market value of smooth operation vs. technical features.

 

Hardware grunt is important! But these days once a relatively low threshold is reached it's other features that drive my decision making.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Good post thesorehead.

I agree totally.

 

But I do still feel it hasnt countered my point. my couple of year old Note1 can video call in skype, navigation, media, web browser has been 110% good.

Yet, we have 'more power' and more cores coming out.

 

I just feel the marketing is the winner at the moment. "this is better, because numbers!" seems to be what I'm seeing these days.

While I try to avoid "who would spend $600 to make a phone call?" type arguments, I do think a lot, an awful lot, could be slashed at this point without affecting usability.

 

With the exception of ppi\screen, I think that Kogan phone does highlight this. Huweui (sp?) phones do too. Big brands, cheap points, and these days, the "usability lost" argument I'm just not seeing stacking up.

 

Though I guess that does speak for itself, when you see the 'mobile addicts' ordering Zoppo phones, and jiayu G3 over locally available things a LOT MORE than you'd have ever seen in the last 5 years of phone dev.

 

Though I guess you did reiterate my point here.

once you reach X specs, the rest is meh.

 

For me thats 800mhz dual core.

More than that and I'm wasting it, it seems.

 

Hardware grunt is important! But these days once a relatively low threshold is reached it's other features that drive my decision making.

Edited by Master_Scythe

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Phones these days have massive potential which phones of previous generations did not. We are still sitting at the same kind of level of usability/functionality as we previously had, we are only starting to touch the potential of new phones.

 

I don't care about gaming on my phone or portable devices, it's usually pretty crap, so I am not missing out on much. I've used my phone to ssh to my server at home, to VNC to my machine if required (not as good as ssh), I've even used teamviewer to another phone to help setup email.

 

Think of the unused resources as 'potential'.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You're still missing my point (or i'm not making it clear) one or the other.

 

I agree, MASSIVE POTENTIAL! but this untapped potential exists on my 2 year old android phone.

How are people justifying the power (more so, cost) of quad core stuff when the dual core stuff isnt even CLOSE to tapped out.

 

I think the impulse buy on phones is no longer the software. Its the hardware.

 

You see a number, or a 'feature' and you want it.

 

as opposed to other platforms (such as your PC) where you make do with what you have usually, and the software (games) or peripherals (headphoens?) are your impulse buy.

 

Im just feeling the whole 'buy a new phone its better' has been nothing more than marketing for the last few years. Especially on these software upgradable android style phones.

And so far no ones argued against this either :P Stop buying phones people, lol. YOU DONT NEED 14 CORES OF TXT MESSAGING AND PORN... well maybe porn.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

OK I guess I missed the part about the newer phones and increasing power and performance still. I agree with this, iphone 5/SGS4 it's just a fashion accessory now, not really a tool. The only legitimate excuse to upgrade is people whos phone is a few years old, like maybe original iphone and need something newer or the old phone is just thrashed/dropped and needs replaced. I bet a good portion of iphone sales come from drunk bitches losing phones when out, I know my sister is on her third one or something, in about 2-3 years.

 

I'm happy with my 2-3 year old SGSII, does everything I need it to, battery still lasts 2+ days and with a 64GB sc card I'm not running out of storage or RAM.

I have an SGSIII 4G but I don't use it much, it's just for work calls and email only.

 

I feel no need to get anything new.

 

Reasons I would consider an upgrade

- significant improvement to battery life (1 week at typical use perhaps?)

- additional hardware compatability (usb port, hdmi port etc.) I think phones will have a place as an all in one thin client type device eventually.

- google wallet\paypass enabled phone (my sgs2 is a bit old for this)

- mSATA/additional storage beyond micro SD

- a good camera, im talking significantly better than anything available now

 

Things I do not need

- bigger screens

- an 'i' infront of my device model

- social media integration/manufacturer software

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

These new processors typically use less power than previous generations. The fact that they're faster is a bonus. You also have to factor in that these new devices have to drive 1080p displays while still allowing high FPS gaming.

 

Multiple cores is actually a power saving technique. The more cores you have, the greater ability to completely disable parts of the processor under low load. The oct-core processor in the S4 may sound overkill, until you understand that four of those cores take up a tiny fraction of the die, and are activated to allow the four power hungry cores to shut down completely.

 

In the end releasing new phones without pushing the boundaries would be boring.

 

The HTC One is popular because it's well built and has a beautiful display, I doubt many people bought it because of the processor it has.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The HTC One is popular because it's well built and has a beautiful display, I doubt many people bought it because of the processor it has.

I hoped you'd chime in :)

 

You've pretty much summed up what I thought. Its fashion. Its 'new'. its not a question of usability, its a question of 'being new'.

 

I know about extra cores and power saving, but that same rule applies to dual core if the die is the same size.

 

In the end releasing new phones without pushing the boundaries would be boring.

And thats just it, in my oppinion, no one is.

The hardware is so far ahead of its use that its not exciting.

Its like being caged but not knowing it. Do I care if you extend my prison if I never knew I was in one? nope.

As soon as something uses it, like "dock for full PC" it'll be neat. but so far, the stream of constant 'minor changes' is killing me with boredom.

 

Even if I pretend I dont want one, the new blackberry if the first thing to push a boundary in a long time. No one's done qwerty.

So was the Experia Play with its joypad.

 

IMO, If you're going to spend money on more R&D of hardware, make it something the consumer can easily appreciate.

Edited by Master_Scythe

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Good post thesorehead.

I agree totally.

 

But I do still feel it hasnt countered my point. my couple of year old Note1 can video call in skype, navigation, media, web browser has been 110% good.

Yet, we have 'more power' and more cores coming out.

Haha M_S I'm not countering your point, just answering your question "What do you use your phone for, that needs MORE processing power?"

 

I could write a massive wall of text decrying the market and it's lack of appreciation for elegance, efficiency and exploration of a feature-rich system. I agree totally with you that mroe power is really unnecessary at this point: the Nokia N8 took fantastic pictures and great 720p video with a 680MHz single-core CPU. But a combination of massive economies of scale, "lazy" (or more likely, rushed) programming, the ever-present need to release something - anything - NEW to drive further consumption and a half-dozen other factors have given us a world where specs are seen to matter.

 

To reiterate: I'm agreeing with you here. Specs only "seem" to matter because the marketing gurus say they do. Consumerist sheep feel a manufactured "need" for "new", and before you know it fools and their money part ways.

 

To be fair, I update my phone roughly once every two years like a good consumer. But I don't just get the "new". I don't buy unless and until a new device appears that satisfies a functional desire, for which the asking price is justified. If I had jumped on the Android bandwagon, I would be quite satisfied today and for the foreseeable future with an SGS2, or something similar but smaller.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I agree, however isnt hardware already WAYYYY above software in this instance?

As the argument was in that HTC thread; the $150 dual core 1ghz phones, vs 4core 'latest and greatest'.

 

I haven't made my mind up :P because clearly my use may be a-typical. but I wouldnt have thought so....

 

I have a semi-modern android device as I said, doing what I thought was typical. If not for 'advanced games' I'm not sure how else I could stress it?

I can even decode 720p on it just fine. Havent had to try 1080.

 

With that said, my 104mhz n-gage could handle 360p just fine :D lol which was above native for it ^~^

Think of some of the technology that is still pretty new in phones like Siri, or some of the VR overlay functionality. They often suffer from lack of client grunt. It's like games and GPUs. You don't want to develop a game that can only be played on $1,000 GPUs, so you have to dumb down the graphics until those high end cards become mainstream. Same with phones. As the average horsepower of phones increases, heavier client based apps will become more popular.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I hoped you'd chime in :)

 

You've pretty much summed up what I thought. Its fashion. Its 'new'. its not a question of usability, its a question of 'being new'.

 

I know about extra cores and power saving, but that same rule applies to dual core if the die is the same size.

The problem with a smaller dual core is that it's probably not as power efficient as it sounds. You'll only be able to turn off half the CPU at most at idle, and chances are that active core will still be larger than the A7 cores on the Exynos 5 (the oct-core chip I mentioned earlier). I looked it up, and the A7 cores are 13% of the size of the A15 cores. So basically those four extra cores are approximately the size of half an A15 core, and they can be switched off independently. If you're going to make a dual core processor it'll probably be an A15 design, which is still quite large.

 

And thats just it, in my oppinion, no one is.

The hardware is so far ahead of its use that its not exciting.

Its like being caged but not knowing it. Do I care if you extend my prison if I never knew I was in one? nope.

As soon as something uses it, like "dock for full PC" it'll be neat. but so far, the stream of constant 'minor changes' is killing me with boredom.

 

Even if I pretend I dont want one, the new blackberry if the first thing to push a boundary in a long time. No one's done qwerty.

So was the Experia Play with its joypad.

 

IMO, If you're going to spend money on more R&D of hardware, make it something the consumer can easily appreciate.

I disagree here. The HTC One has tangible benefits in all areas. Additional memory (2GB makes a large difference in my experience), camera capable of low light capture, high fidelity microphone (
), arguably the best speaker design on the market, an extremely crisp display, and unibody design.

 

All that is a worthy upgrade for many. Considering the number of people on contracts these days, every 2 years they basically get a free upgrade. Of course they're going to choose the best thing on the market, it'd make no sense not to. OEMs don't expect you to buy a device every year, they simply want you to choose their device when your contract expires. If an OEM doesn't keep up with the latest tech, the chances of being purchased dwindles. Yay competition!

 

You seem to think that qwerty is the only thing that is considered pushing the boundaries. I disagree, it's simply regression to pander to people stuck in hold habits. Software keyboards are amazingly good these days. You can't get the same level of word prediction on a hardware keyboard.

Edited by .:Cyb3rGlitch:.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I agree about people not really needing this stuff. The vast majority of people who own these phones have absolutely no idea what they're capable of. They're $800 Facebook machines, drunk photo machines, text message like 'twas 2003 machines.

 

That said my phone is very old and its charging port has been on the way out for a while. That's the only reason I got this phone, my old-old phone had the same problem. I use this $50 piece of shit way beyond its original intentions, using it mainly for facebook, browsing, and email on the postage stamp sized screen. I'm someone who'd make a little more use of a fancy new phone than most, as evidenced by things like my PC browser with its hundreds of open tabs, many with videos queued up. My Firefox process is 2GB... I'm also someone that has a lot of high definition video content ready to shunt onto a flash card and enjoy on these gorgeous new displays. That would make travel and waiting for stuff a pleasant experience. But I'm pretty sure I wouldn't need a quad core battery melting CPU to do that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I disagree here. The HTC One has tangible benefits in all areas. Additional memory (2GB makes a large difference in my experience), camera capable of low light capture, high fidelity microphone (

), arguably the best speaker design on the market, an extremely crisp display, and unibody design.

 

All that is a worthy upgrade for many. Considering the number of people on contracts these days, every 2 years they basically get a free upgrade.

 

Point one is quite fair, it hits that 'prosumer' market.

HOWEVER you need to consider which of them will be actually used.

 

Its not the first phone with 2GB of memory, but might be the first western one? This will be used; if apps dev with it in mind

The camera I can see being a selling point for a lot of people. But once again, its high end consumer. Anyone who likes photos carries a camera, even a P&S camera will totally wreck a smartphone. This will be used, but the difference I'm not so sure will be appreciated when not doing A\B comparisons.

Microphone is good, I agree, but once again, if thats something you're into, you'd own a pocket condenser or the like. While neat, I dont see it used as its demonstrated. Potential, but I doubt it.

Speakers I think would be a 40\60 selling point. A lot of people use it for a music machine granted, but I don't know how many use it as a high fidelity music machine. I'd say the majority just use it to fill a room with noise, not to critique the quality.

Crisp display is good and all, and not something I can appreciate with my eyes, however this is another 'wow' factor that you soon forget and just use. Is it better than SuperAMOLED? It doesn't bring any new usability.

Unibody design is cool in a description, and even from a design standpoint, and servicing too. But the consumer wont care once they own it. Not used. great gimic that caught even my attention

 

I humbly admit this is very much a case of "just because you don't...." and just like my need for QWERTY, someone out there will have a need for a few of the above features, but for most, I think they're marketing checkpoints.

I went in with an open mind and picked up the demo one in an optus store and honestly, didn't see anything new.

Another piece of glass and steel that you can touch, use facebook, music and phone stuff, and worry about breaking. Still I dont see a modern phone that I think is 'safe' to use without a case. <- this one is BIG, admit it. Even parents and oldies comment on this.

Seemed like "another android phone" to me. I went in being excited by the TV ads too. disappointed IRL.

But, as above. Different strokes.

 

As for the contract thing, thats always bullshit. Not your comment, the contract. and the idiocy of people angers me a lot.

Lets take my situation and get the best of all worlds eh? With a brand new phone, and a good plan.

 

I'd like the telstra network, for reliability and speed.

Kogan is the cheapest telstra provider, and have worked out their kinks (i've been following it closely on a lot of forums).

Just below $25 for: Unlimited-Unlimited-6GB = $600 over 24 months.

 

Lets now assume I'd like the latest phone of my preferred brand. the BB Q10.

I'd like an Australian Warranty.

I'd like to go from a company with KNOWN good customer service and after sales support.

So that limits it to reputable shops, like Unique Mobiles.

$650.

 

Total $1250 over 24 months.

 

Compare that to Optus' plan (because its cheaper than telstras), 450mins - Unlimited txt - 500mb

Thats a $65 plan (50 + 15)

"Min. Total Cost is $1,560.00 over 24 months"

 

Business plans often work out a bit cheaper granted, but no, they dont 'get a free phone' every 2 years.

They get a significantly worse value plan, and still spend an extra $150 a year (in this scenario).

 

I know people dont think things through on impulse buys, but "free upgrade" it is not.

 

 

I'm on a $16 plan with virgin right now that should be $50+ because virgin didnt read their terms and conditions very well, and I applied discount, to discount, then my "BYO handset" bonus on top of it.

Not even possible if i'd 'taken the free phone'. Trust me I've saved way more than a new phone is worth.

 

But I'm pretty sure I wouldn't need a quad core battery melting CPU to do that.

Just reiterating. ^ that.

 

Let me refine my point further then.

Development of hardware has advantages, say, quad core disabling 2 cores. OK. I accept this, and thank you for clarifying :)

I'd put dollars to doughnuts that the market for the new 'powerful phones' isnt the first phone buyers.

I'd argue any day the sort of people buying them, already have a phone with untapped potential. and not a small amount.

Edited by Master_Scythe

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Re plan pricing, $65 per month may be more expensive in the long run but it's far cheaper in immediate terms than spending almost $700 the first month. Sure if you have the cash to splash, a lot of the expense is 'over with' and you can enjoy an even cheaper monthly cost into the future, but for a lot of people, spending $700 now is not cheaper than spending $300 extra spread over 2 years.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm overly cautious, but I'd say if you didnt have the 'cash to splash' to use your terms, there is no way in hell you should be signing up to a contract thats going to cost $60+ a month. Thats lunacy.

 

Its also a huge load more than $300 that you're losing out of if you consider the plan inclusions as well. I, for example, would need a data pack on that 500mb.

6GB I would not.

Edited by Master_Scythe

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

'Why so much processing power in phones?'

 

Because they can and they sell (lots, just look at how many S4s' have been sold for the short amount of time it's been out), making the companies producing them a tidy profit.

 

That doesn't invalidate anything you're saying M_S (your pov makes perfect sense to me :p). It didn't stop me from getting a One myself when it was phone upgrade time.

 

Most important point -> It's just because they can.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

'Why so much processing power in phones?'

 

Because they can and they sell (lots, just look at how many S4s' have been sold for the short amount of time it's been out), making the companies producing them a tidy profit.

 

That doesn't invalidate anything you're saying M_S (your pov makes perfect sense to me :p). It didn't stop me from getting a One myself when it was phone upgrade time.

 

Most important point -> It's just because they can.

As long as people recognise that, I was just trying to clarify and I'd be happy :)

 

I do wish companies would do something though. Form factors, accessories, something.

If they just keep releaseing 'better, because better' they're going to risk Apple-ing themselves.

 

I pop quiz up to 10 people a day on this shit, because I'm annoying like that, and everyone ive asked has recognised "no, my iphone 4 is good enough. I don't want a 4S or 5".

I think they hit "that point" with the 4. And I think android has hit it now too. hence why so many phones are coming out that are completely samey.

 

If it were me, I'd have 3 things on the market.

1. a phone with slide out numpad, for people who actually PHONE a lot.

2. a phone with a slide out keyboard (portrait) to have beaten blackberry to the punch and put that final nail in the coffin. Now the dead have risen. Not well... but they have.

3. something that protects the screen. a little raised rim, or a free ULTRA slim case (i'm talking 1mm). So when I buy a phone, I can use it. Not baby it untill i spend ANOTHER $40 on a suitable protection plan.

 

I honestly wonder if ANY non nokia phone could withstand their testing.

http://gizmodo.com/a-look-inside-nokias-ab...-labs-706712798

 

And I wondered why my GF didnt worry when I flung her Lumia across the room against a brick wall by accident when I swung a jacket over my shoudler.

Edited by Master_Scythe

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ask anyone who has a Nexus and tries to do more than one thing at a time on it. It's not about just more hertz. It's also about non-shit implementations.

 

Why do we need bigger numbers for anything? Because they need to sell us something better than last year's offering whether it's a phone or a tablet or a PC or a car. If you were on a two year contract for a car, wouldn't you get a new car every two years if the cost was negligible?

 

Or, as you seem to actually be asking, why do people buy cars that can go faster than the speed limit?

 

PS, slide out numpad? lol. The only reason one of my parents has a smartphone at all is because numbers on a touch screen are bigger to hit and easier to read.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If you were on a two year contract for a car, wouldn't you get a new car every two years if the cost was negligible?

err... no. Cars, like all my tech, is a matter of love; or I wouldnt own it.

I find it much harder to part with things I love than that.

 

And yes,I do wonder why people buy cars that go faster than the speed limit. Its why I like torque in an engine (yet i own a honda.... go figure?)

Edited by Master_Scythe

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ask anyone who has a Nexus and tries to do more than one thing at a time on it. It's not about just more hertz. It's also about non-shit implementations.

 

Why do we need bigger numbers for anything? Because they need to sell us something better than last year's offering whether it's a phone or a tablet or a PC or a car. If you were on a two year contract for a car, wouldn't you get a new car every two years if the cost was negligible?

 

Or, as you seem to actually be asking, why do people buy cars that can go faster than the speed limit?

 

PS, slide out numpad? lol. The only reason one of my parents has a smartphone at all is because numbers on a touch screen are bigger to hit and easier to read.

 

Don't even bother, he's in his own world.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ask anyone who has a Nexus and tries to do more than one thing at a time on it. It's not about just more hertz. It's also about non-shit implementations.

 

Why do we need bigger numbers for anything? Because they need to sell us something better than last year's offering whether it's a phone or a tablet or a PC or a car. If you were on a two year contract for a car, wouldn't you get a new car every two years if the cost was negligible?

Or, as you seem to actually be asking, why do people buy cars that can go faster than the speed limit?

PS, slide out numpad? lol. The only reason one of my parents has a smartphone at all is because numbers on a touch screen are bigger to hit and easier to read.

 

Don't even bother, he's in his own world.

 

Yeah I felt that when I read it, but I still wanted to reply because... well... I hate when people dont. lol.

 

on the topic of shit implementations though; I honestly havent seen many that havent been fixed with software.

They will always exist, hence SOME advancement always; I just feel its become samey.

 

Hence asking what you use it for. To be really shallow.

 

Its a fucking piece of glass, on a piece of steel or plastic, you rub your fingers on to do stuff.

I find it hard to see how marketing is being so successful when I didnt think people were honestly using the full potential; AND it will cost them more money. Small or not.

 

Its like buying my mum an overclocked i7 rig when shes still working at her maximum speed on a Celeron D.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Its a fucking piece of glass, on a piece of steel or plastic, you rub your fingers on to do stuff.

I find it hard to see how marketing is being so successful when I didnt think people were honestly using the full potential; AND it will cost them more money. Small or not.

 

So people who play taxing games on their phones aren't using the full potential of the phone and need to buy something cheaper because you say so?

 

 

Wtf? Why is this even an argument?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×