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Master_Scythe

Why so much processing power?

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Its a fucking piece of glass, on a piece of steel or plastic, you rub your fingers on to do stuff.

I find it hard to see how marketing is being so successful when I didnt think people were honestly using the full potential; AND it will cost them more money. Small or not.

 

So people who play taxing games on their phones aren't using the full potential of the phone and need to buy something cheaper because you say so?

 

Wtf? Why is this even an argument?

 

You're just talking without thinking or reading aren't you?

In my first post I acknowledge games may be whats pushing the tech. and I openly asked the question.

 

go WTF your own posts if you're not going to contribute quality.

 

and to answer you question; no this is not an argument at all. Its an open discussion about usage and buying habits.

Edited by Master_Scythe

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I bought one of the best phones on the market because I don't want a piece of shit that can't even keep up with OS.

 

If you want a piece of shit phone that can't keep up, then great. We each have our own preferences.

 

Sorry for skipping almost all of that kerfuffle of a wall of text in the OP.

 

 

 

 

brb, off to WTF at my own posts.

Edited by bushi

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I bought one of the best phones on the market because I don't want a piece of shit that can't even keep up with OS.

 

If you want a piece of shit phone that can't keep up, then great. We each have our own preferences.

 

Sorry for skipping almost all of that kerfuffle of a wall of text in the OP.

 

 

brb, off to WTF at my own posts.

translation: I spend money to think mine is better than yours.

 

My 2 year old Note1 has never had any lag. even in intense 3d games. So, wrong.

Please dont put words in my mouth "you want a piece of shit". Where did I say that?

But its OK, I accept your apology for commenting on a thread you didnt read. no harm done.

 

You sound worked up, chill.

Edited by Master_Scythe

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translation: I spend money to think mine is better than yours.

:/ ..... errr

 

My 2 year old Note1 has never had any lag. even in intense 3d games. So, wrong.

Please dont put words in my mouth "you want a piece of shit". Where did I say that?

But its OK, I accept your apology for commenting on a thread you didnt read. no harm done.

 

I wasn't saying, YOU specifically. "everyone has their own preference"

 

 

Come back when you've matured and speak sense.

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If you want a piece of shit phone that can't keep up, then great.

I felt it read like you were directing it at me. Misunderstanding then; all good.

 

I bought one of the best phones on the market because I don't want a piece of shit that can't even keep up with OS.

So in that case, you were misinformed. Because as we've been discussing, you only need like... half... of whats current to keep up with the OS. Which once again, helps my initial point.

 

It's my thread, I'm not going anywhere; sorry to disappoint.

Edited by Master_Scythe

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I think about this almost every day, when did applications get so bloated that they need "supercomputers" to run every day apps.

I used a Nokia E52 to do almost the exact same thing I am doing now on my Motorola Droid 4.

However for some reason it needs a dual core 1.2GHz Cortex A9 (vs a single 600MHz ARM 11) and 1GB of RAM (vs 128MB) and yet still manages to freeze up all the time...

And this is using basically the same apps, Opera browser, IM App and music player.

 

Now I understand games needing the power (compare mobile games from a few years ago to today, quality is much improved) but for everything else where is the power going?

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Will be hard to go back with no Symbian Lync client..

 

Wonder if Mail for Exchange is still setup and working for google, if so I probably could.

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Go back to your E52 and you'll quickly realise where that power goes.

Is it the touch screen and drivers for it?

 

I'm honestly curious because my last phone was the E72, and before that the E61.

Both never lagged doing the same thing as my current phone is now, the only reason I upgraded is because I have perfect 100% signal from 7 different towers (waterfront surrounded by islands) and the Symbian OS gets confused tower hopping so 3G wouldnt work at home on it.

 

Read my opening post to see my list of usual things. (Tabbed browsing, music, and chat at once). No lag on the S series, no lag on Android. But exacltly. uses alot more power.

Screen size and touch is my guess.

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I mentioned cars because of novated leases, fleet cars, etc.

 

Wanting something specific and only buying and keeping that is fine, but judging by the contract cycles for phones, it's not something most people really worry about.

 

 

 

If there is an expected hardware upgrade cycle that will be maintained, feature creep is going to pop up in programs and suck away extra cycles. It's the reason my 3GS runs like a dog.

 

re shit implementations, again, Tegra chipset, eg http://www.geek.com/android/the-nexus-7-la...al-fix-1560784/

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re shit implementations, again, Tegra chipset, eg http://www.geek.com/android/the-nexus-7-la...al-fix-1560784/

Although I agree that Nvidia make rubbish SoCs, the problem here is I/O. That article claims otherwise, but I'm extremely suspicious of their testing methods. Fill up memory on an N7, and it will turn to shit. I've been able to reproduce it 100% reliably on many units.

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I think it's wrong to complain about the processing power of mobile devices.

 

If we look into the past, Pentium 4 chips could do facebook, msn, email etc... but the Haswell chips of today can do all that at ridiculously lower power consumption, with the ability to be fast in other tasks that the Pentium wouldn't dream of handling in a reasonable manner.

 

It's the same thing with the last console generation. "Why put so much hardware into these it just makes them expensive!?" quickly turned into "these consoles pale in comparison to current PCs".

 

Put the best technology available into a device, so that it ages better and raises the bar in the long term. Of course you have to provide a good enough value that people will buy the device, and I think the Samsungs and HTCs of the mobile world are striking that balance well.

 

Build it and they will come.

 

brb, off to WTF at my own posts.

WTF

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I like your post a lot Frunj, but This is sort of what I'm getting at.

Everything you say is true, but I dont think devices are getting the chance to 'age well'. I think this is slowly working into a marketing\consumerism thread isn't it?

 

Put the best technology available into a device, so that it ages better and raises the bar in the long term. Of course you have to provide a good enough value that people will buy the device, and I think the Samsungs and HTCs of the mobile world are striking that balance well.

I think samsungs and HTC are developing better integration, and slight power improvements (battery), but otherwise are completely overkilling specs as a whole, for the sake of 'the better number' because besides gaming, in which case you're excused, I think the 'dual core 1ghz' phones hit the sweet spot (for now).

 

This is emphasized well by people who bought Zoppo or Jaiyu phones (thousands; look at sales numbers) and almost not a single bad thing to say about them internet wide. If you look up the Zoppo camera reviews on youtube, I've not seen a phone that can come close to that quality yet (though admittedly I haven't seen the absolute latest gen; such as the HTCOne) especially at the $200 price point (which the One is not).

 

I was looking up the chips used in current gen, and there are almost always lower clocked (or binned) chips that are a lot cheaper that could be used (quad core 1ghz would be fine for 99% i'd imagine?)

 

Don't misunderstand this thread, I'd love the latest and greatest too, just feeling fatigued by "faster, because it is!" when a year or more ago we hit the "no lag for the masses" point.

There will always be exceptions, mind.

Edited by Master_Scythe

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I guess you like the Nokia Lumia 920 with it's stabilised lens and decent night shots, and the soon to be released 41MP Nokia Lumia 1020.

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I guess you like the Nokia Lumia 920 with it's stabilised lens and decent night shots, and the soon to be released 41MP Nokia Lumia 1020.

To an extent. Especially the 1020.

Its a good example of technology for the right person though.

If you like photos, yet for some reason don't carry an actual camera, this is at least coming close.

It's not for me, but if, for some reason, I didn't want to own a camera too, then this'd fill the gap.

 

And yeah, its not just another "We added a number, and the CPU is faster. Sure it didn't lag before... but buy it"

 

Its a "we noticed you like taking selfies and instagram shit these days, so, if that's you, here's something that will suit."

Just like BB said to 'my crowd' "we see you like doing long typing (1000+ words) on the go, so heres a nice qwerty"

or the apple people "we see you don't like tech, so we made it friendly; slightly limited, but friendly; just works!"

or Jaiyu "We heard you hate screens breaking, so we made one you can hammer nails with or crack walnuts! Break it? we replace it"

 

as a broad generalisation, its not a common move though. People are releasing more glass with a battery that you touch and make calls, play games and social network.

At least that Lumia is offering something that stands it out from the crowd.

 

I dont expect everyone to agree with me; not many people usually do :P but as is shown in this thread, I'm not alone in my feeling.

Edited by Master_Scythe

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Most modern devices have multi-speed CPUs. Just checked my phone (Huawei Y201 / A5 @ 800 MHz) and it spends like 80% of processing time at 300 MHz. That said though, many portable devices have the 3D rendering built into the CPU and it would be logical that it runs at or near top speed for such operations.

 

The bottlenecks with Android devices are generally the storage subsystem (most flash devices in use pale against mechanical HDDs), the OS itself, and the fact that most modern-day apps aren't native Assembly code or even necessarily a lower level language like C.

 

We may well say "Wow, my phone has more grunt than a PS2 or XBox original" but the truth of the matter is that for starters a RISC CPU will practically always require more cycles to perform a given task than a CISC and that programs written in a higher level language will run slower than those written in a lower level language (though of course the PS2 has a RISC CPU).

 

What does my phone need grunt for? Games, viewing PDFs... even 'net browsing. Piddly Ram compared to a PC and no paging subsystem = the need to render pages on the fly rather than being able to render once and buffer it nicely away somewhere.

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100% true, agree, A+

 

On that note, you have said grunt. Besides flashy TV ads it doesnt sound like you're searching for more

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Available grunt in the modern day just becomes an excuse for OS, App and game programmers to get lazy.

 

Just look at the system requirements for Windows as it evolved from 95, 98 through to XP and beyond.

 

Essentially not a great amount of added functionality other than eye-candy, yet the memory and CPU requirements rise almost exponentially.

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true, but the computing world seems to have recognized this where the phone world hasn't.

 

There is only so lazy one can get before you exhaust the development language :P (within reason, lol)

 

I don't go and buy my mother an i7 haswell chip for her typing and facebook.

I can get away with a Celeron D and she wouldn't even feel the difference.

 

If i wanna be a little unrealistic, I could probably even go earlier (early P4 with HT) and weaker than that if I optimise the services running (in relation to phones: install cyanogen or other custom firmware).

 

 

So many people have phones that could probably rival their PC in terms of sheer grunt; lazy coding taken into account. Where is the rest going? is what im getting at, lol.

More so, if its not, why are people buying MORE, lol.

Edited by Master_Scythe

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I disagree with that article. Smartphones are nowhere near the performance plateau of desktop machines. It only appears that way because app developers optimise for battery longevity. Once battery tech gets better, the race will resume at a much faster rate.

Edited by .:Cyb3rGlitch:.

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I wouldn't a mind a less powerful phone if it meant the prices were a lot lower!

The upright cost for an iPhone or Galaxy S4 is ridiculous!

Edited by 8vm

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I wouldn't a mind a less powerful phone if it meant the prices were a lot lower!

The upright cost for an iPhone or Galaxy S4 is ridiculous!

I suggest looking into the Nexus line of devices. Low margin, high performance, updated by Google directly. The new Nexus 4 will probably come out in Nov/Dec.

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I mostly agree with the article - for 99% of people the Galaxy S2 is enough for now and the GS3 is enough for the foreseeable future. Hell, with a bluetooth mouse/keyboard, an MHL cable and wireless charging pad/backplate the thing can be used as a desktop PC! And IMHO maybe 80-90% of people would find their needs met by its capabilities in that capacity.

 

I think that we hit this kind of performance plateau some time ago actually, with Tegra 3. The ASUS Transformer Prime and MS Surface RT are both capable devices which provide all the performance and capability that an average user needs. Of course, it's always nice for a device to do the things you need faster or better, but "good enough" was reached in 2011.

 

Now it's just a matter of this level of tech becoming "cheap enough" so that it is ubiquitous - just like what happened with PCs.

Edited by thesorehead

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