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scruffy1

how crap is this government ?

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🙂

 

Give the AEC one small break Ev, they oversee what is quite possibly the least corrupt electoral process on the planet and they only manage that on limited funds and working faster than a cat covering shit.

 

If you fine them, which I would suggest is ridiculous in the first place you are simply making their job more difficult by sequestering funds that they desperately need to be doing their job in the first place.

 

In short, get off the grass....

 

Cheers

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AEC fined?    What's the point?  It's a government agency so it'd be just taking away some budget allocation and putting back into consolidated revenue.

 

I've had a bit to do with AEC in an external support role in the past - they're pretty small, used to be part of DAS (Admin Services) but now seem to be part of Special Minister of State.

Though that said, they're an independent body.

To be employed by them you pretty much have to have no formal political affiliations so they're pretty impartial.

I don't think they have very many staff - when elections are held the bulk of the work is done by temps.

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2 minutes ago, Rybags said:

AEC fined?    What's the point?  It's a government agency so it'd be just taking away some budget allocation and putting back into consolidated revenue.

 

I've had a bit to do with AEC in an external support role in the past - they're pretty small, used to be part of DAS (Admin Services) but now seem to be part of Special Minister of State.

Though that said, they're an independent body.

To be employed by them you pretty much have to have no formal political affiliations so they're pretty impartial.

I don't think they have very many staff - when elections are held the bulk of the work is done by temps.

And volunteers - lots of volunteers.

 

I do not think it in the least fair to attack them, they are batting WAY above their weight.

 

Just give them a break, no one is perfect.

 

Cheers

 

 

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Posted (edited)

I suggest you get off the grass chrisg ... your armchair is lonely.

 

7 hours ago, Rybags said:

AEC fined?    What's the point? 

Yes. They are in charge of the voting booths on the days.

As well as monitoring the behaviour inside where the voting is happening it would be good policy for them to make sure signage and party promoters are doing the right thing outside too. It speaks to our credibility of a good standard of ethics 😉

 

Quote

 

It's a government agency so it'd be just taking away some budget allocation and putting back into consolidated revenue.

It would be taking money out of our Gov. coffers and giving it to our drought relief.

 

Quote

 

I've had a bit to do with AEC in an external support role in the past - they're pretty small, used to be part of DAS (Admin Services) but now seem to be part of Special Minister of State.

Though that said, they're an independent body.

To be employed by them you pretty much have to have no formal political affiliations so they're pretty impartial.

I don't think they have very many staff - when elections are held the bulk of the work is done by temps.

I've had nothing to do with them apart from their staff monitoring my behaviour whilst I vote.

According to my brother, his partner was employed by the AEC during the last election. He didn't specify figures, but it was apparently a worthwhile month of work for her. I guess it depends on what capacity your are temporarily employed in.

Edited by eveln

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🙂

 

You genuinely are just plain and simply ignorant.

 

Drought relief would never benefit from fining the AEC, the money would vanish into "general revenue."

 

AEC employs as much as it can for the electoral process on a a surge basis because elections can be called at short notice, often are.

 

If you are employed the pay is about 50% above minimum wage but in order to get it all done they also have to rely upon a lot of volunteers.

 

It is utterly pointless to fine a government agency, particularly one that has to position itself above politics by the very nature of its mandate, I should think even you might understand that....

 

Cheers

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2 hours ago, chrisg said:

🙂

 

You genuinely are just plain and simply ignorant.

 

Drought relief would never benefit from fining the AEC, the money would vanish into "general revenue."

 

AEC employs as much as it can for the electoral process on a a surge basis because elections can be called at short notice, often are.

 

If you are employed the pay is about 50% above minimum wage but in order to get it all done they also have to rely upon a lot of volunteers.

 

It is utterly pointless to fine a government agency, particularly one that has to position itself above politics by the very nature of its mandate, I should think even you might understand that....

 

Cheers

Perhaps if you were not so quick to insult, the idea of making the AEC more accountable for our voting standards was not a bad idea. After all that is what they do, or at least try to do . At the least, there should have been English translation along with that Chinese signage. ... I told you already, your armchair is lonely

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The money has to be good in such temporary jobs - generally you're not getting sick or rec leave or long service.  And often no superannuation.  And being temporary there needs to be some incentive for people to take it on.

No leave in itself equates to almost 15%

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"They wedge the ALP the best" ... Yep seems Labor enjoys a good wedgey these days 😞

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Just how on earth do you make an agency such as the AEC accountable Ev?

 

Fines are ridiculous, you are taking money out of one pocket and putting it in to the other.

 

The only way is be extremely careful of just whom you employ in the first place.

 

That may not be ideal but it is, within our open (more or less) government system possible and the AEC has a well deserved international reputation for being extremely honest and impartial.

 

Yes, they slipped a little here, it has been called to their attention, they will doubtless be even more observant in the future, there the matter ends.

 

Stop with wanting to fine everybody for everything, it is plain stupid.

 

Cheers

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22 minutes ago, NZT48 said:

I say let the market be free.

What market ?

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1 hour ago, eveln said:

What market ?

The Australian market.

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But a market is a market cos trade happens there. A market is never free. 

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Accountable?  You have the likes of the National Audit Office and Senate Committees.  And probably processes through the High Court as well.

 

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2 hours ago, Rybags said:

Accountable?  You have the likes of the National Audit Office and Senate Committees.  And probably processes through the High Court as well.

 

And all that will use up more precious monies than slapping them with a fine and having one of their temp staff patrolling the areas at the gates where the various parties display their signage. It's not fucking rocket science (despite  chrisg's unwarranted ire, although, I think his ire is more at me than the idea ... lol  )

It's illegal for opposing persons to interfere with another's signs, and no one wants to see fights ( verbal or otherwise ) between the folks manning their tickets on the day. So it is the bloody obvious conclusion that the AEC needs to deal with it as part of their work.

And the fact that no one dealt with this particular dodgey signage means more wasted time with elected dudes being questioned on the eligibility of their winning their seats. Although, it is a pity none of the opposing parties made a proper fracas about it on the day ...

or did they ?

 

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🙂

 

Hardly - I just think you over reacted, not exactly unusual with you, to a totally excusable oversight by the AEC that you immediately want to censure and fine - which as explained is rather pathetic.

 

They missed something - I doubt it made much difference to the outcome at all, but it could be construed as somewhat nefarious by the party on the day.

 

What's new?

 

Pathetic Parliamentarian wannabes try to skirt the rules all the time - most of the time the overstretched AEC keeps them in check - what little they miss is most probably inconsequential anyway - nothing to get your knickers in a knot over....

 

To quote someone the price of freedom is continual vigilance - thanks for noticing 🙂

 

Cheers

 

 

 

 

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4 hours ago, eveln said:

But a market is a market cos trade happens there. A market is never free. 

Do you think I mean everything in the market costs nothing?

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11 hours ago, chrisg said:

 

Hardly - I just think you over reacted

Well. Given what you've stated about yourself in another thread lately, I'll take your words with less than a grain of salt. ... feel better soon

 

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10 hours ago, NZT48 said:

I mean the market should have freedom.

 

Maybe once upon a time of many small businesses. In this day and age one business prices out or swallow up all the smaller guys, competition goes to zero or close enough and everyone loses. 

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10 hours ago, fliptopia said:

Maybe once upon a time of many small businesses. In this day and age one business prices out or swallow up all the smaller guys, competition goes to zero or close enough and everyone loses. 

You are assuming a few things. If people know that they can support the smaller businesses and/or benefit from paying more in businesses competing with the big ones then that won't happen. Socialism is a problem. Crony capitalism is a problem. Free market capitalism is not a problem.

 

Also: less regulation and taxation benefits new enterprise greatly, makes it easier to get off the ground whereas big business loves it because it hinders competition.

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1 hour ago, NZT48 said:

You are assuming a few things. If people know that they can support the smaller businesses and/or benefit from paying more in businesses competing with the big ones then that won't happen. Socialism is a problem. Crony capitalism is a problem. Free market capitalism is not a problem.

 

Also: less regulation and taxation benefits new enterprise greatly, makes it easier to get off the ground whereas big business loves it because it hinders competition.

 

You assume things of people that is clearly not shown to be the case. There *are* those who will support small business but people gravitate towards price and convenience. Bigger businesses can more easily follow trends in consumer sentiment. You can't divorve cronyism from capitalism.  In many cases regulation is the only thing that keeps competition. Not all regulation is good, granted. But I think that is more a fine tuning thing than removing regulation all together. 

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