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scruffy1

how crap is this government ?

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10 hours ago, Leonid said:


And yet we’re one of the richest people on earth. Our middle class sits easily in the global 1%.

 

How do we think it got there?

 

Well you can thank China for that. All those ghost cities built with our coal, steel and other stuff.

Edited by Jeruselem

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this seems to have merit :

 

The Australian Federal Government currently have a petition open, and if it gets enough signatures by October 16th it will mean that they will debate declaring a climate emergency in the lower house.

Unlike other advocacy groups, this one is by the parliament meaning they will debate it if they get the signatures so please spread far and wide.

When signing, make sure you do the last step which is verifying your email. ✌️🌎🌍🌏

https://www.aph.gov.au/petition_sign?id=EN1041

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2 hours ago, scruffy1 said:

the parliament [...] will debate it

 

"All in favour of declaring it bullshit?"

(in unison) "AYE!!"

(two greens) "Nay?"

"Motion carried.  We'll get on with strip-mining Queensland, shall we?"

 

😛

 

I mean, ok, having a debate is better than nothing, I guess, but it's not what is required.  The science has been in for a long time, and those numpties have to say about it matters not at all.

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ya, but if the fuckers won't even mention it in parliament, then nothing will ever happen

 

at least in generations to come (as they perish from neglect) hansard will make it abundantly clear who chose to ignore some potential for mitigating the situation

 

 

as frogs boil it's perversely satisfying to document who didn't even think about turning down the stove

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4 hours ago, scruffy1 said:

debate declaring a climate emergency

 

And what's that do?

 

290506953_Greenshot2019-10-1022_51_01.jpg.6a098f06ab91f212324c31e41e91c9f3.jpg

 

 

12 hours ago, Jeruselem said:

 

Well you can thank China for that. All those ghost cities built with our coal, steel and other stuff.

 

So we empowered our rich to build our economy while China empowered their economy by giving to their rich too.

 

Cool.

 

 

Edited by Leonid

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It's a balancing act Leo, and we do not know where the apex is.

 

The biggest problem in China is that the masses of people have been given a taste of wealth and if it is shut off ie. power cuts, they are very likely to revolt.

 

That's a lot of people mass - I have said repeatedly, the Chinese hierarchy is more afraid of their own people than they are of most anything else. They seem to be walking a very thin line in Hong Kong at the moment and that is just the tip of the iceberg.

 

China is a crap shoot at the moment that could get very brutal, but it is not exactly the Lone Ranger, the ME looks like exploding again, usually not TOO overt England is violently divided and the US is finally waking up to what an incompetent Trump is.

 

The next few months are going to be more than interesting, and not in a good way, and I have not even covered all the pressure points.

 

Cheers

 

 

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Adani seems be a bit toxic, contractors are running away ... I can't blame them. if the mine never makes money, they might not get paid.

 

https://www.smh.com.au/business/companies/another-firm-cuts-ties-with-adani-over-qld-mine-20191010-p52zm4.html?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook#Echobox=1570703639

Edited by Jeruselem

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On 10/10/2019 at 11:51 PM, chrisg said:

 

It's a balancing act Leo, and we do not know where the apex is.

 


It’s not a balancing act Chris.

We’re past that now.

 

The Arabs won’t tell China to stop gulaging Muslims, Apple withdraws apps because the Communists want it to, Blizzard removes online players for supporting the Hong Kong protests, airlines aren’t allowed to fly to Taiwan anymore - it’s Chinese Taipei (despite ROC being the official founding member of the UN and with a rightful spot on the UNSC).

 

Even forgetting all that - China has the natural right to power its way to middle class the same way we did.

 

It’s game over. Anyone still playing is the worst kind of idiot.

 

There are five solutions:

1. bomb China to the stone age

2. sanction them to the stone age

3. Adapt

4. Build technology to “scrub” GHGs

5. Get off-planet

 

3-5 are the only viable solutions because they’re what we’ve always done.

 

We’re not stopping or reversing climate change.

 

If you’re still playing that game I’ve a participatory anarchic democracy for you to vote in.

Edited by Leonid

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THAT is impossible to predict, there are way too many variables.

 

That has been the problem for a very long time and why someone came up wit the analogy of the butterfly in the Amazon producing a hurricane in Florida.

 

Not exactly probable but energy can be neither created nor destroyed only changed fro one form to another.

 

Gaia, planet Earth, has many, many tricks up her sleeve and her ability to heal is immense.

 

 We messed up the ozone layer with CFCs,we stopped making them, it's healing. We stopped killing whales, they are back in bigger numbers every year.

 

Now we are beginning to clean the oceans and they will recover if we keep at it.

 

What we need to do is get greenhouse gasses down and whilst I agree with you China is not exactly helping they are not just thinking about but actually planting massive forests to sink carbon. So is India.

 

It is just a beginning but every little step is an improvement.

 

I think I'll take my optimistic view not your Russian doom and gloom because one has hope, the other only resignation.

 

We are not (I hope, going to bomb China back to the stone age, because what remains if anything would all be there.

 

Sanctions will not stop them, nor will tariffs, wastes of time any we actually rely on them for too much anyway.

 

Adapt if not really much of an option, technology simple and complex may assist and we cannot get off-planet in time, so we have to look after this one better.

 

That will not be easy but I'm of the belief that some initially quite modest but accelerating changes will  have very strong effects.

 

But you see I believe in Gaia, you don't, you think of Earth as inert, I do not think it is, not at all.

 

Cheers

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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As I said - adapt, get off-planet or use a technology option.


Those are the only options because they’re the only ones we have ever done. Even your example of stopping CFC production was a technology change. Whales don’t count - that’s not a global calamity affecting the ability of humans to live on this planet.

 

We have already proven that we cannot switch to solar or wind.  Yes, we’ve vastly increased renewables, but as total coal emissions, we’ve maybe taken them down a little at best. In other words we’re front-loading our population growth with renewables while the base-load coal/gas remains at roughly the same capacity. And we’ve no answer to this.

 

More importantly not-one in the West has an answer as to how to transition the world’s baseload off coal at at least the same rate as China is onboard omg additional fossil fuel plants.

 

So uh, no, Chris - this ain’t doom and gloom. It’s the same question we faced in the 60s and 70s re global food production - the prophets of doom said billions were going to die, etc. one bloke called Norman Borlaug came up with a technology solution - saved the world, so to speak.

 

Renewable energy is not going to prevent climate change. It actually assures it because while we’re not fixing the problem, we’re patting ourselves on the back as if we’ve solved something.

 

It’s the rough equivalent of commies celebrating equality once they’ve murdered half the population and impoverished everyone.  It’s the rough equivalent of Labor’s “heroes in their own minds” compassion that saw a thousand with change drown at our borders and created a drugs and human smuggling racket on our border.

 

Humans are wired for irrational belief. Solar and wind will save us. Lawd Jaysus is saviour. Vaccines are dangerous because 0.001% have a bad reaction.

 

The simple reality is it’s too late to stop climate change.

 

It’s game over. Anyone still playing is the worst kind of idiot.

 

There are five solutions:

1. bomb China to the stone age

2. sanction them to the stone age

3. Adapt

4. Build technology to “scrub” GHGs

5. Get off-planet

 

3-5 are the only viable solutions because they’re what we’ve always done.

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2 hours ago, fliptopia said:

Because they make less money if they pass on all the savings 😉

 

Josh worked for Deutsche Bank at one stage, he knows why. It's just a flipping circus.

Edited by Jeruselem

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