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Dasa

AMD Zen

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Posted (edited)

Same settings, with and without the dimm cooler... I wanted to remove it because it is so darn loud and annoying sound pitch, but might put it back in since my temps on the dimms are much much higher without it.  With the ram cooler, even after 4hrs of aida, it was a high of 29c on both dimms, without and in 15mins on aida, it hits 42/40c on them.  Also, in 15mins, MB and CPU temps higher even with turbo fan settings it will not compensate for the removal of fan dimm cooler.  

 

fan-compare.png

 

Edit:  and with gaming it gets into the low 50c and locked up... Dam I guess I need to put that back in.  It really helps for stability keeping the temps low, first time it has locked with 3733mhz.  

---

Edit:  And the world is much more silent now... a bit of velcro and foam on the one side for my janky fix 🙂  Threw some foam in the empty spots in my bays near the pump too.  Temps are now 32 and 30c with the foam vs 29c on both without.  But much better than the 42 and 40c without the dimm fan. 

 

20190803-143730.jpg

 

 

Edit:  I tried 2 different sticks of ram for fun.  My rgb 3466 would not post passed 3466, it did give decent latency considering it would not go lower than 16 on the timing of 72ns.. and the hynix would not post passed 3200, didnt bother running test since I could not get it to go higher than 3200.  

 

I do seem some people have got better latency than I can get with higher timings at the same bandwidth.   There is another bios update coming soon supposedly. 

Edited by gamble

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What size are the fans in it? maybe replace them with noctua fans, that or find a old fan to strap over the RAM.

But if your foam has done a good enough job all good.

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@Dasa I think this will be good enough and even with the side panel off you reall do not see it much.  Also, thanks for letting me know about the new ram calculator.  I was trying to manually do this before and was just getting boot loops.  Using the tool and setting to fast timings I was able to get down to 65ns latency!  Im still running thru the array of bench/stress tests now.  I still cannot get 3800mhz to post with 1:1 and think it might just be a chip limitation.   Im close to when I had my 2600x in latency speeds.  Ive spent soo much time tweaking ram, Ive had no luck with overclocking the processor.  But it has been fun with ram.   Im not sure what tool to use to get the full timings that I have as the older asrock tool dosent work with ryzen 2 now.  

 

65.png

 

 

 

 

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Posted (edited)

Hasn't been updated in a while but try Ryzen timing checker

https://www.techpowerup.com/download/ryzen-timing-checker/

 

From what I have read 3800 with 3700X is hit and miss and people with 3900X have a higher chance while i very much doubt 3600 would get there.

 

Great to see you finally made it under 65ns

It is nuts that you can run 3733 with 14-14-14 on Ryzen with that RAM as to do the same on Intel would need ~1.7vdimm I guess

It would be good to see some CPU limited game tests vs the RAM at stock XMP.

Edited by Dasa

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Posted (edited)

Yea over the next few days I would like to make sure it is totally stable with these timings.  I did a quick couple of runs on the below comparing my previous best scores to these timings.  Im super curious of what the difference would be from 3200 stock ram vs 3733 would be.  

 

TimeSpy: Best vs Previous Best, CPU +6%
https://www.3dmark.com/compare/spy/8030996/spy/7829278

 

FireStrike:  Best to Previous Best, Physics +.03% .. Combined +5.4%
https://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/20068095/fs/19873963

 

It seems to have helped my graphics scores a bit too or possibly driver updates played a part.  Also, I have updated my chipset drives that came out a few days ago.  

 

Oh and the ryzen tool says not supported. 
 

Edited by gamble
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lowered the ras a bit the rest of the timings the same, over 1700% on memtest... I think Im done with ram tweaking, was fun with good results.  Aida is 64.9ns nearly every time. Ill try to do some compares in the next week with 3200 stock vs 3733 tweaked. 

 

tight-timings.png

 

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oh wow that is a darn good jump.  Was interesting when they used 2133 with high infinity too...

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Yeah it still sees really big benefits with inter core communication from higher IF even with RAM left at lower speeds.

At least provided the difference is big enough to offset the latency increase from running outside of 1:1 ratio.

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AMD are nerfing new BIOSes removing PCIE 4.0 from pre-X570 boards!

 

https://www.techpowerup.com/258044/amds-latest-agesa-update-removes-pcie-4-0-support-from-pre-x570-motherboards

 

AMD's latest AGESA update, which is being seeded to motherboard manufacturers, culls efforts to implement support for PCIe 4.0 in boards not carrying the latest X570 chipset. Some motherboard manufacturers had enabled support for the new standard on existing B450 and X470 motherboards - some with limited support, as was the case on some of ASUS' motherboards, others with full support. However, these efforts from motherboard manufacturers went against AMD's strategy with their X570 platform - all in all, these "rogue additions" reduced one additional feature of new X570 motherboards over their older counterparts.

The new AGESA code carries the part number AM4 1.0.0.3 ABB, and will likely be reflected in manufacturers' release notes for new BIOS versions that incorporate the code - and remove added PCIe 4.0 functionality. Other changes in this AGESA code release include fixes for Destiny 2 gamers' woes, which were having a hard time getting the game to run properly on Ryzen 3000 processors. If you're an avid Destiny 2 player and want PCIe 4.0 support, you'll likely be reminded of Rick and Morty's pickle episode. If not, you can always defer these AM4 1.0.0.3 ABB updates, if your system is behaving properly.

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2 hours ago, SceptreCore said:

So... Just overclock the fabric, and tighten the timings and you're good to go.

Or do all 3 🙂 But Yea big gains from timings.  Running 1440p res my gain are even smaller of course for games. Seems like some games like it and everything seems super quick all around with tight timings. But did have to put ras back to 32 as it errored at 2.5hrs in Aida, memtest passed 1700% and p95 was good over 8hrs.  That is why I test so much as I want 100% stable.  That was a really good review and liked how he tested several cards and highlighted stuff when talking and comparing. 

 

--

 

Sucks about losing 4.0 in upcoming bios but I currently don't have a use for it.  Just knowing it can and they won't, is just strange from amd. 

 

Installed latest chipset drives but monitoring software (msi afterburner and hwmonitor) is reporting wrong clocks vs Master.  

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2 hours ago, gamble said:

Or do all 3 🙂 But Yea big gains from timings.  Running 1440p res my gain are even smaller of course for games. Seems like some games like it and everything seems super quick all around with tight timings. But did have to put ras back to 32 as it errored at 2.5hrs in Aida, memtest passed 1700% and p95 was good over 8hrs.  That is why I test so much as I want 100% stable.  That was a really good review and liked how he tested several cards and highlighted stuff when talking and comparing. 

 

--

 

Sucks about losing 4.0 in upcoming bios but I currently don't have a use for it.  Just knowing it can and they won't, is just strange from amd. 

 

Installed latest chipset drives but monitoring software (msi afterburner and hwmonitor) is reporting wrong clocks vs Master.  

my brother is going to upgrade to a 3600. He currently has a 3000 kit, so I think I'll just do what Steve did and save him some cash.

 

As to PCIe 4.0 support... well... you can bet there'd be class action by some who wouldn't understand why some can and some can't if it can't be technically guaranteed. Also... AMD want to sell x570 chipsets. So I don't blame them taking this action. It's not like people have to replace their board if they want the new chip... but if they want that upgrade. I get it... nothing's free.

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3600 is a killer chip for the price.  I might have gone that way if it was released and reviewed at the same time as the 3700x/3900x.  Yea that kit will be just fine... 

 

So, I just bought one of these ram coolers since it has a pwm, was cheap and can angle it.  I thought my ghetto fix with the foam would be enough but I cant take it and the leds are sooo bright, Im just done with the Gskill one...

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32750671016.html

 

Picture 1 of 6

 

Product Dimension

157(L) x 64(W) x 102(H)mm

Box Dimension

145(L) x 68(W) x 50(H)mm

N.W.

185g

G.W.

225g

Memory Type

DDR DDR2 DDR3 DDR4 DDR5

Voltage

12V

Fan Speed

500-4000RPM

Current

0.22A

Bearing Type

Hydraulic bearing

Air Fow

6.8-19CFM±10%(single 6025)

Air Pressure

0.59-4.36mmH2O±10%(single 6025) 

Cable Longth

20cm

Connector

2510-4 pin(PWM)

Noise Level

10.8-32.1dB(A)±15% 

Accessories

Extended cable 10cm with 4pin connector - 1,
Extended cable 6cm with Molex (M&F) 4pin 
connetcor - 1, Screwdriver -1

 

Gskill cooler has 22dB (fixed, cannot adjust speed) and 8.6 CFM vs this one that has 10.8dB on low with 6.8-19CFM...  Just hope the sound pitch is different.   I like that I can angle it too. 

 

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Posted (edited)

New found appreciation for those that do reviews... this took quite some time to run, plot and chart... I was going to do loose 3733 vs 3733 tight timings but I dont think it would be worth the time as this took hours and the difference is small.  If I ran 1080p, the difference would be more pronounced Im sure like reviews have done. 

 

Besides TimeSpy and FireStrike, all were ran at 1440p and the same GPU clocks. 

Stock XMP profile 3200mhz vs Tight timings 3733mhz both were 1:1 ratio with Infinity:

 

1.thumb.PNG.cc82ff073ef3822867860e5bff8cfc08.PNG

 

2.thumb.PNG.0e9b6893bd26b54f235f3ac7b93b3fdc.PNG

 

3.thumb.PNG.01f1031118ea8bc49e733005ea2f556c.PNG

 

4.png

 

 

Edited by gamble
  • Yes Sir! Very atomic! 2

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Posted (edited)

Huge jump in AoS CPU test while the rest is about what you would expect being largely GPU limited and 3dmark being a rather small test it doesn't really flood the CPU cache like open world games do and I guess Civ is the same.

Edited by Dasa

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Yea at 1440p it was going to be small jump just thought it would be a bit more.  Im sure on productivity suites it would be large gains but being mostly a games test here, all GPU limited.   1080p would have saw probably a few more percent in games but 1440p is what I game at and wanted to check as most reviewers did 1080p. 

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Posted (edited)

Ram only affects CPU performance so honestly I am surprised the difference isn't smaller.

I wonder if you would see any difference vs your 2600 in those tests or if they would also be within 2% of the 3700X.

Most productivity suites see much smaller gains from RAM speed than CPU limited sections of gameplay.

Edited by Dasa

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Posted (edited)
43 minutes ago, gamble said:

2600X is actually scoring higher than 3700X in shadow of tomb raider due to margin of error and in metro the 3700X is 1.3% faster than 2600X but this could just be margin of error again.

And that is with a 2080Ti pulling a lot more FPS than your 2080.

 

I wonder why Intel CPU are slower than AMD at 2560x1440 in shadow of tomb raider while they win at 720p and are close at 4k\1080p

Edited by Dasa

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yea that is strange at those different res for Tomb.  As cheap as some of those older cpu's are now, for a gaming rig running 1440p or 4k you cannot go wrong with many options, just gpu bound mostly.  Save the money for a good gpu and psu.  

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