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chrisg

Android oddities

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I'm not really a 'phone expert at all, networking is my thing but I'm confused.

 

Both my wife and I have exactly the same 'phone and on exactly the same software, they are both pretty plain Jane - we don't game on them, I have a few extra apps but they are not autostart, yet they are behaving completely differently when all I want to do is add ES File Explorer to both...

 

I can't say I like this latest version of Android much either, things that were easy are suddenly a bit obtuse.

 

Specific problems:

 

App downloaded on mine, having fun getting the icon onto the home page - it was supposed to do it itself but I'll sort that out

 

Does not want to install on my wife's one at all, taking the "leave it alone" approach at the moment but she is the one who needs it because she put a heap of pictures up on "Smart Drive" instead of keeping them local and now can't seem to readily access them to email to people.

 

Anyone use this programme or able to suggest a better file manager?

 

I went with it on the advice of HowtoGeek but thus far not really impressed.

 

Believe me, it's a good 'phone, it's I think this latest version of Android.

 

Cheers

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Weird, I got es file explorer installed on my nougat android 7.1.1 android TV device which doesn't support standard stuff like google chrome ...

 

You didn't say what phone you have btw.

 

Confusingly es file explorer has two nearly identical entries in google play store.

One is version 1.08 pro and 4.1.54 which is the working free version.

Edited by Jeruselem

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:)

 

I did but only in the subtitle - Moto X Style.

 

Yes I noticed the two versions but definitely dowloaded the free one to both 'phones.

 

It is weird, I'll just have to keep plugging away at it.

 

Cheers

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You can side load the es file explorer apk file on an android phone if google play isn't behaving itself but that does open a potential security issue.

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Hmm,

 

I'd thought of that - security I can handle by other means. I'm just starting to wonder if this is the right file manager for her, she's not very tech savvy and I have no idea what she has been doing with hr phone :)

 

Thing is step-daughter has a new baby and has been sending through pics via her iPhone - I really do not care what people believe it is too easy for an iPhone user who is just that, a user, to cause problems for an Android recipient who is equally or more naive...

 

I need to have a think and do some research - it's not urgent but it is bemusing...

 

Cheers

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Yeah, tried that, not quite sure what she did but didn't work :)

 

Cheers

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Sounds like I'd be backing up the contacts, factory restoring the phone, and starting again.

If you dont know what she's been doing, and you dont think she knows either, it's better safe than sorry.

 

But yes, ES is a tough program.

 

It's better to teach her to save files from within the MMS messages, then mass storage device on the PC.

I understand it 'didnt work' but that's what i'd be focising on getting working...

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Default to put new programs on the home screen or not can vary among versions or devices and you can run entirely different launchers which can take over the entire GUI in themselves and change the behaviour.

 

I use ES FS here, often a device will have a file manager included but it's usually pretty basic and underpowered.

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Hmm,

 

Yes, it may come to that, she's just using the default launcher but from a chat with Motorola support a lot of people, actually including me, are less than happy with the latest Android version - a lot has changed, for no apparent reason.

 

Cheers

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I need ES FS on my nexus player, just because I can do stuff with OTG drives.

The defaults apps on the Nexus player are awful.

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Hmm,

 

Yes, it may come to that, she's just using the default launcher but from a chat with Motorola support a lot of people, actually including me, are less than happy with the latest Android version - a lot has changed, for no apparent reason.

 

Cheers

 

I'm usually a stickler for "It works, dont break it!" but, just like Android evolved from the clunky 'Gingerbread' we used to hate to the smooth Lollipop (yes I'm skipping steps to what I thought was significant); you'll soon realize Android Nougat is a huge leap forward in usability.

 

Change can suck, and I despise change, but this time, they've FINALLY made it feel like an 'operating system' rather than a huge bunch of services clumped together.

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What are you doing that necessitates ES File Explorer anyway?

 

I'm going to wager a guess at file management :P

 

The built in file explorer in Android is shithouse when it comes to trying to save or move files between say, an OTG usb stick and the phone.

Something I do daily to backup my phone to my keychain; just as one example :)

Edited by Master_Scythe

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What are you doing that necessitates ES File Explorer anyway?

:)

 

It's not what I'm doing, it's some stupidity click and drool my wife has been doing - personally I treat "Smart phones" as morons that need medical attention :)

 

She's one of those clean-up fanatics that always wants to shove stuff into folders and then delete originals.

 

This time she picked the wrong folder and it is proving a chore :)

 

I'll get there but it would be useful if she could tell me what she did, but she has no idea :)

 

We are talking about a 71 year old woman with a cardiac condition and other medical issues and pictures of her first grandchild that she has put somewhere and we can't retrieve them - welcome to the cloud :)

 

She's learned her lesson, I told her you have masses of spare local space why the fuck would you not keep them local ?

 

I THINK that sunk in :)

 

It's half her daughter's fault though, iPhone addict, so instead of sending her mother pictures in email , which her mother understands, she keeps doing this SMS bullshit.

 

Eh, will clean it up, but I will repeat, currently I do not like this latest version of Android much...I can see why you say it is on track, but it would be nice to have some Nikes for the trip :)

 

Cheers

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Heh, my mum has trouble using a windows phone. She's around the same age as your wife. Mind you she's using Viber a lot recently.

Edited by Jeruselem

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It's half her daughter's fault though, iPhone addict, so instead of sending her mother pictures in email , which her mother understands, she keeps doing this SMS bullshit.

 

Eh, will clean it up, but I will repeat, currently I do not like this latest version of Android much...I can see why you say it is on track, but it would be nice to have some Nikes for the trip :)

 

Cheers

 

 

Heh, my favorite part about Android Nougat, is that its, IMO the final usability nail in the coffin to attack Apple fanbois.

 

I'm happy to admit where apple has some neat exclusive apps, and what not, so that lures some people (my mate uses it purely for its receipt scanner, which android doesn't have nearly as automated); but when peopl try and call out usabiility, polish, 'logical' use patterns, simplicity, etc.

 

I can finally wave android in their face and show them alphabetical app draws, nice icons, fast lag free response, and even 'simple mode'.

Ah bliss :P

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Having actually played with a Pixel in a Telstra shop, I readily admit that Android is finally "here" in terms of the user experience.

 

You can reliably do all the common tasks without ever being exposed to a directory structure. Lack of an SD card slot means there's no more stupidity with content in disparate data stores. Google's voice assist is on-par with Siri in all the ways that count. Google Music finally has feature parity with Apple Music. Etc etc etc.

 

And providing that Samsung and others can get their shit together and be consistent with updates, the heterogeneity factor is becoming less and less relevant as time goes on. Hopefully.

 

Android is finally coming of age. It's good for everybody.

 

But to "wave in their face"?? The only answer you'll get to that kind of smarmy shit is "took you long enough".

 

Android phones have been around since 2008 (HTC Dream, I owned one!!), only 1 year after the first iPhone, and yet its taken them until now to deliver a cohesive user experience. Pretty lackluster effort if you ask me. Good that they finally made it though, it'll only help push things forward.

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But to "wave in their face"?? The only answer you'll get to that kind of smarmy shit is "took you long enough".

 

 

Don't worry, if they try that, I always have Symbian to fall back on. Copy paste, multitasking, browsable directories, while they were still in '1 app, no 3G' territory.

 

They want newer? Blackberry from 6~10 also kicks their ass in too many ways to list. Even ecosystem; office, PDF, and even social media was current until a few months ago.

 

If they want to play the superiority game, there has been something ahead of them the entire way.

Remember, we're talking OS vs OS, if they have to start adding apps, disqualified.

 

Really though, whenever someone brings up the 'comparison', I can shut it down in one sentence;

"Nice bluetooth stack, want to send me something? Oh wait! You still don't have file, or printer support....Don't worry, one day you'll reach the 90's"

 

It's all fun and games, horses for courses, but when someone brings up the 'Oh mines better' you just have to be well practiced in counters :)

 

People get oddly defensive of their "Apples". I just move to whatever is currently the best OS, regardless of developer.

If one day apple lets me use my (literally) pocket computer, like a pocket computer, and not like a locked down kiosk PC, I'm all in!

Edited by Master_Scythe

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If they want to play the superiority game, there has been something ahead of them the entire way.

Remember, we're talking OS vs OS, if they have to start adding apps, disqualified.

Your definition for superior is pretty nerdy though, and your practices and habits are very 90s.

 

Not meant in a negative way, mind. There's a lot of stuff I do on my PC that's completely anachronistic, like keeping my apps in s:\programs and games in d:\games instead of Program Files.

 

My "s:\my documents" has been transferred from PC to PC since 1996!!

 

"Nice bluetooth stack, want to send me something? Oh wait! You still don't have file, or printer support....Don't worry, one day you'll reach the 90's"

Standing around like goofballs transferring stuff by bluetooth is best left in the 90s, I agree.

 

People get oddly defensive of their "Apples".

Well, you get super defensive of your "I need a phone that works like a PC" usage pattern.

 

Is it so surprising that others get defensive when you tell them their usage patterns and habits are "wrong" or "inferior"?

 

I just move to whatever is currently the best OS, regardless of developer.

If one day apple lets me use my (literally) pocket computer, like a pocket computer, and not like a locked down kiosk PC, I'm all in!

 

 

Trouble is that your very specific and personal definition of "best" is something that lets you treat a phone like a desktop computer.

 

Most phones aren't trying to do that, aren't even interested in doing that.

 

This loops around to the whole idea of eschewing "files and folders" as the entities you interact with. What a person wants to do with their phone is "Send a photo to Amy", they don't think in (nor should they be expected to think) in terms of "Transferring IMG_8973.JPG to 04xxxxxxxx by MMS".

 

Files and folders are a rubbish concept for general usability. And I understand how brain-breakingly wrong that sounds to us nerds, but remember that the remainder of the human race are not nerds.

 

Edit: I owned S60 smartphones. Yes! I had an N-Gage, and a 6680. I owned a number of early PocketPC/WinMo phones, and the aforementioned HTC Dream. Each of them had individual features I really liked, but I wouldn't give up modern Android OR iOS content-focused workflow for that files-and-folders environment. Not a chance. (And I say that as somebody that uses MS-DOS in my hobby!)

Edited by SquallStrife

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I still have my ngauge.
Was playing SonicN the other day.

The way it handles background apps, and the ease of app switching, and the way the managed to do it all without a touch screen, making it all faster and more compact was just bliss.

But I dont disgree, to each their own.

 

 

However on the bluetooth side, I've had 10's of older adults ask how to do it; and I've had to tell them they can't.

 

Even now, with no data plan or PC available (which happens REGULARLY in far north QLD, who is one of my main supported sites; and regularaly with people on "Senior"\Pension plans), backing up an iPhone is near impossible....

Android though, OTG USB stick, bluetooth to another phone, whatever. It 'just works', theres no "extra" requirements. The device has core functionality the other just lacks.

Thats just normal every day people trying to live their lives.

 

And I think I just had a moment of self realization too; Thats exactly what it is ^

Apple "EXPECTS" things of the user, and 99% of the time, that's money, or living conditions.

They dont even think of the people 800kms out of town, who will be on 2G for the next 10 years.

 

They EXPECT you to have special propriety cables, to buy 'apple branded' peripherals (still cant get my squeezeboxes to work on iOS), and so on.

They dont accept I've already bought LOCAL storage for my backups, I dont want to use your ONLINE option.

But they take that away....

 

 

Well, you get super defensive of your "I need a phone that works like a PC" usage pattern.

 

Well, of course.

If I didnt want to carry a PC with me, I wouldn't have a smart device, plenty of 3G enabled flip phones for those who DONT want to carry a mini computer.

Edited by Master_Scythe

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However on the bluetooth side, I've had 10's of older adults ask how to do it; and I've had to tell them they can't.

 

Even now, with no data plan or PC available (which happens REGULARLY in far north QLD, who is one of my main supported sites; and regularaly with people on "Senior"\Pension plans), backing up an iPhone is near impossible....

Android though, OTG USB stick, bluetooth to another phone, whatever. It 'just works', theres no "extra" requirements. The device has core functionality the other just lacks.

Thats just normal every day people trying to live their lives.

There's always a fringe element that you can't cater to, and likewise, there are sacrifices you make when you choose to live somewhere that only has 2G.

 

As I said, it's good that Android is finally coming of age. Good for everybody.

 

And I think I just had a moment of self realization too; Thats exactly what it is ^

Apple "EXPECTS" things of the user, and 99% of the time, that's money, or living conditions.

They dont even think of the people 800kms out of town, who will be on 2G for the next 10 years.

No device is made with 100% of human beings in mind. Apple devices are made for the (imaginary figure) >80% of people that live in cities and have disposable income,

 

They're not made for the 15% of people that live outside of cell coverage, or the 5% of people that are ultra-stickler, highly habituated ubernerds.

 

Well, of course.

If I didnt want to carry a PC with me, I wouldn't have a smart device, plenty of 3G enabled flip phones for those who DONT want to carry a mini computer.

I carry a PC with me. It's an MBP.

 

But I /also/ carry a smartphone because it's a smaller, more manageable device that lets me do a subset of my social/hobby/media consumption activities when I'm away from a desk or PC.

 

It's not a PC, it's not a PC replacement, it's a complimentary tool.

Edited by SquallStrife

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However on the bluetooth side, I've had 10's of older adults ask how to do it; and I've had to tell them they can't.

 

Even now, with no data plan or PC available (which happens REGULARLY in far north QLD, who is one of my main supported sites; and regularaly with people on "Senior"\Pension plans), backing up an iPhone is near impossible....

Android though, OTG USB stick, bluetooth to another phone, whatever. It 'just works', theres no "extra" requirements. The device has core functionality the other just lacks.

Thats just normal every day people trying to live their lives.

There's always a fringe element that you can't cater to, and likewise, there are sacrifices you make when you choose to live somewhere that only has 2G.

 

As I said, it's good that Android is finally coming of age. Good for everybody.

 

And I think I just had a moment of self realization too; Thats exactly what it is ^

Apple "EXPECTS" things of the user, and 99% of the time, that's money, or living conditions.

They dont even think of the people 800kms out of town, who will be on 2G for the next 10 years.

No device is made with 100% of human beings in mind. Apple devices are made for the (imaginary figure) >80% of people that live in cities and have disposable income,

 

They're not made for the 15% of people that live outside of cell coverage, or the 5% of people that are ultra-stickler, highly habituated ubernerds.

 

Well, of course.

If I didnt want to carry a PC with me, I wouldn't have a smart device, plenty of 3G enabled flip phones for those who DONT want to carry a mini computer.

I carry a PC with me. It's an MBP.

 

But I /also/ carry a smartphone because it's a smaller, more manageable device that lets me do a subset of my social/hobby/media consumption activities when I'm away from a desk or PC.

 

It's not a PC, it's not a PC replacement, it's a complimentary tool.

 

 

We can agree to disagree on the last point, because thats just personal preference.

My phone has RDP, a web browser, SSH, and basically everything I need in a PC, I stopped carrying a laptop (as did 3 colleagues) when we bought Blackberry Passports. The laptop just isnt easier enough to warrant taking it out of the bag.

But that's up to the user. Blackberries multi-touch capacitive, physical, keyboard just makes a perfect trackpad mouse. the RDP experience is just 1:1 with, say, one of those Sony Mini PC's.

 

 

And man, you're right, apple devices are made for that 80% with disposable income, agree, totally, no sarcasm.

Problem I've always had, and it's not JUST apple (mainly is.... but not exclusively), is purposefully EXCLUDING that 20%.

 

Keeping on at the topic of OTG and Bluetooth, since I've used them as an example already;

 

There is NO REASON why those are excluded. The iPhone (as proven when jailbroken) DOES have a full bluetooth stack, they've just disabled file sharing, and printing. It wouldn't make the end user any more 'nerdy' to have them as an option. If they didnt use them, they're the type of options they wouldn't even know existed.

Printing even more so; "Use AirPrint, it just works!" is no reason to ALSO say "We blocked bluetooth printing, just 'caus. Buy a new printer, Mr Walking-Dollar-Sign"

 

And OTG? Well they'd never know unless they went out of their way to buy a "USB stick" designed for their phone, the option wouldn't even present itself!

 

There really is no excuse for that sort of exclusion behavior. It's literally the adult form of bullying. "You're different, so you can't join in, change to be like us".

 

 

A real life example;

My father was on a special plan until recently when VAYA matched it, plus some data.

He's a builder.

He had to transfer a few hundred MB's of plans to his architect, which I copied to his phone for him (old people, don't own USB sticks).

This was great until we got to the architects office, no microUSB (of course, proprietary cables.... GREAT) his iPhone couldn't receive bluetooth or NFC file sharing.

The office also used desktops, so no wifi (old fashioned, but secure I guess, they all had desktop PCs for the rendering grunt I assume).

 

In the end, we bluetoothed it to MY phone, where I ejected my MicroSD, and handed it to the architect who copied it using his digital camera as a MassStorageDevice in the PC.

 

I mean holy fuck....

We have a normal, 65+yo builder, just trying to send a file in the way that's been normal for 10's of years, just to be stopped by "we disabled it, buy data". Even now, that'd be 25% of his monthly data!

 

It's fucking not on.

 

Simplify all you want, make the 'advanced options' as deep and convoluted as you want, but don't willingly exclude people, or technology.

forcing conformity on anything consumerism focused should be a crime. Consumers deserve choice.

Bullys.

Edited by Master_Scythe

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I mean holy fuck....

We have a normal, 65+yo builder, just trying to send a file in the way that's been normal for 10's of years, just to be stopped by "we disabled it, buy data". Even now, that'd be 25% of his monthly data!

Using phones as makeshift portable storage isn't really "normal" IMHO.

 

Maybe normal in nerd circles.

 

It's fucking not on.

 

Simplify all you want, make the 'advanced options' as deep and convoluted as you want, but don't willingly exclude people, or technology.

forcing conformity on anything consumerism focused should be a crime. Consumers deserve choice.

Bullys.

iPhone is one phone.

 

There are kazillions of Android etc phones out there that allow you to do your geeky nerdy stuff just fine.

 

What's with the victim complex? The world is in no way obliged to entertain your oddball holdover habits.

 

It kinda seems like you're mad that everybody isn't a nerd like us.

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