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Master_Scythe

Being forced to transplant!

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Well my friends, I've long had a problem with my PC that was 'no big deal'; if I got out of the chair quickly and 'thumped' the floor at all, my PC would freeze; quick reboot and away we went.

 

Even though I'm lucky enough to have a 5820K that won the silicone lottery and can reach 5Ghz; it didnt surprise me, because there are some parts that are old as sin.

The case had lived case-panel less for about a year, and the GPU is held together by zipties.

 

Anyway, after a solid 'bump' a reboot wouldn't get it past the POST screen; reseated RAM, and nope.

This cost me my second ever Abandon in DOTA in 12 years.... This was now not OK.

 

Ripped the case off the shelf and started investigating....... and I found a bunch of 'sand'.

I live near a beach, and near a train line, so I thought nothing of this grit. Until I realised "Hold on, why is nothing else in my house gritty.......".

 

Blew out the case and went to reassemble, when I noticed something quite.... interesting.

 

First I looked at my Coolermaster heatsink......

 

UgosuJc.jpg

 

Yeah, that's not ideal.....

 

As it turns out, while anodizing should protect Aluminium from low concentrations of Gallium (as was my thermal compound), I didn't consider that the grooves machined into the anodized block for the heatpipes will be 'raw' aluminum....

 

As such, the 'spot tested' section was A-OK (unbroken anodize), but, after about 11 months of application.... this.....

 

This explained 3 things:

 

1. Where the 'sand' was coming from.

2. What was causing the freezing (metal flake falling on the GPU)

3. Why my OC had gone from 82*C at load, to 91*C at load.

 

All of these are not ideal.

 

 

SO, off I went to the local MSY, and came home with two new items.

 

uGgFyvI.jpg

 

The Masterbox5 was an impulse purchase, as my old case didn't have room for a 240mm Rad, and I didn't want to settle for a 120mm.

But my god am I glad I purchased it, I'd recommend this thing to ANYONE. SO roomy, so logical, so just outright NICE.

 

 

Ok, next I unboxed my first ever watercooler (yes, its AIO, but I couldn't wait for custom parts, and it was only $80).

So the positive review points are all true, it's a SUPER easy fitment, especially on Haswell-E (4 stands, and a hold down plate, done).

And the pump is Super duper quiet, even out of the case, just powering it 100%, is near silent.

 

However, something the reviewers didn't mention; The finish on the cold plate is WOEFUL.

This picture is after about 5 minutes with some 2000grit.

The visible Grain was what was there from the factory, I was hand-sanding against the grain to knock down the peaks.

I knew I wasn't going to actually lap it entirely, I just wanted to knock the peaks a little closer to the valleys, so hand sanding it went.

TVbLWcF.jpg

 

No matter how imperfect the hand pressure might have been, I can guarantee it's an improvement;

Also, since I didn't knock the 'grain' off entirely, anywhere, if we assume the plate was 'basically flat', then I haven't created any significant low spots doing it by hand.

 

This time I decided to play it safe and used the last of my favorite non conductive TIM

 

TC-GC03-A_specs.jpg

I really hope I had enough left, the Haswell-E core is bloody huge and I only manged a single line down the middle about the thickness of thin spaghetti.....

Temps looked OK though. Ill order some more and re-paste to be sure.

 

 

So, After a bit of fiddling and realising the sealed 'fill' location on the AIO cooler is a TERRIBLE spot, and won't let me mount it how I wanted, I fiddled a bit more and ended up with this!!! (twin JetFlo fans on the front of the case, blowing through the rad)

 

xKDf0Xr.jpg

 

 

As you can see, the GPU is the 'weak spot' in the system, an HD7850 isn't quite the nice card it used to be, especially once the screws have rusted through and you're holding the heatsink on with cable ties....

Cable management was a pain, but much easier than any other case..

 

I had someone tell my my PSU was upside down, but I have nothing but success with using the PSU as an exhaust fan in the past.

 

My PSU lights up White.

And I have a white LED JetFlo fan to replace that stock black one in the rear (there's a reason it's not hooked up, lol)

 

So I'll have a final picture once I've finished the case beautifying and decided what GPU to install in there.

 

There's an HD7970 for $100 locally that's a real steal.

There's also a GTX960 for about the same, which is still a big jump in performance but without the power draw.

All I play is DOTA, so it just needs to run that at 84FPS (which is what I managed to Overclock my IPS monitor to!)

 

OK, kids, don't play with Gallium heat pastes unless you're sure your metals are OK.

I had to take the 2000 grit to the CPU heat spreader for a second too, to remove the Gallium staining......

Edited by Master_Scythe
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Are those fans blowing into the case thru the radiator? I'd be doing it the other way around.

 

Does that case have venting under the PSU? Mine has that and a filter which means I can suck room temp air into the PSU though it's probably overdue for a filter clean.

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Are those fans blowing into the case thru the radiator? I'd be doing it the other way around.

 

They are. A lot of people say this, but, no.

When I'm pushing 5Ghz (I'm considering stopping at 4.5ghz when I reapply my OC this time), I don't need 'hot GPU heated case air' to be cooling my radiator.

 

Also, for dust management, I want a positive pressure environment inside my case.

 

Does that case have venting under the PSU? Mine has that and a filter which means I can suck room temp air into the PSU though it's probably overdue for a filter clean.

 

Certainly does.

But I still don't see the point.

I've been doing it this way for YEARS, using the PSU as an exhaust fan for the bottom corner of the case that gets GPU heat.

 

They MUST be able to handle it!

Remember when PSU's were more commonly top mounted?

Back in 100*C P4 Extreme days?

 

Top corner is much hotter than bottom corner.

Edited by Master_Scythe

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Yeah. I've been thinking about flipping mine over. The case doesn't get very hot inside anyway.

What made the decision for me was that the cabling is a bit tidier with it situated to suck external air.

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with psu that shut off the fans having it facing up allows heat to rise into the case which is better for the psu or in cases with good positive pressure it would help keep it cool

i have the psu fan on my tj08-e facing down (top mount) to take out heat rather than up being a strong positive pressure case

having the fan facing in also helps slightly with noise although not so much with a mesh case

 

dam that hs is a mess thanks for the pics

 

if this is anything to go by gtx 960 would struggle maintain 80fps in wot at 1080p max detail

http://cbgamesandhardware.blogspot.com.au/2016/12/world-of-tanks-budget-gpu-comparison-at.html

its only ~20% faster than the 7870 while the 7970 is ~30% faster

Edited by Dasa

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I'm considering one of these for an upgrade:

https://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/riverhills/components/gigabyte-geforce-gtx-670-oc-2gb/1155316615

a GTX 670 should be a nice jump up from a HD7850.

Just not sure if I want to go from a 2GB card to a 2GB card.

$100

 

 

Or, if I spend $150

https://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/mount-gravatt/components/gigabyte-windforce-gtx-770-4gb/1156725912

GTX770 4GB

 

Might be the wiser move.

 

That said, for $50 more, I can get a brand new 1050ti.

 

Or keep looking for a second hand 1060.....

Edited by Master_Scythe

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My upgrade path was HD5850 -> R7-360 -> GTX 960 and in both cases a healthy increase in performance.

I guess given the 7850 is 2 gens newer than the 5850 that it's probably within a bee's dick of an R7-360.

 

Though all that said, the modern cards tend to trounce the older ones if you bump the resolution up to 1080.

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My upgrade path was HD5850 -> R7-360 -> GTX 960 and in both cases a healthy increase in performance.

I guess given the 7850 is 2 gens newer than the 5850 that it's probably within a bee's dick of an R7-360.

 

Though all that said, the modern cards tend to trounce the older ones if you bump the resolution up to 1080.

 

There's a 1060 6GB locally for $300, but I offered $250.

 

I know that Currently thanks to bloody EtherMining finding cards is IMPOSSIBLE, and the price is RIDICULOUS, I just find it hard to justify $300 for a second hand card, that was $297 new less than 6 months ago.

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Yep, for that reason part of me wants all the crapto-currencies to just crash.

 

Problem is, then the market would be saturated with a bunch of second hand cards that've had the guts flogged out of them.

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Yep, for that reason part of me wants all the crapto-currencies to just crash.

 

Problem is, then the market would be saturated with a bunch of second hand cards that've had the guts flogged out of them.

 

and I would buy one..... lol

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Certainly does.

But I still don't see the point.

I've been doing it this way for YEARS, using the PSU as an exhaust fan for the bottom corner of the case that gets GPU heat.

 

 

 

Same, I always mount bottom fit PSUs that way up, because the case filters (if any) are far from 100% effective and a bottom mount PSU fan just sucks a crapload of dust in to the case.

Bottom intake fan is a cretinous idea IMO.

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It shoudn't suck anything into the case... the fan is on the base with a decent seal, the only other open part of the PSU is the vent at the back where the mains goes in.

Mine has a filter which can be pulled out and cleaned without having to open anything up... if not for that I'd have just done it the other way.

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gtx 670\960 will perform about the same

gtx 770 similar to 7970

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...the GPU screws rusted how?

 

Salt air.

After about 4 years I just heard a 'ping' and one screw was snapped (spring under it flung it inside the case).

Upon even touching the others with a screw driver, they all also snapped (seriously, no strength was applied).

My guess would be galvanic corrosion.

 

Not really, just outright rust!

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gtx 670\960 will perform about the same

gtx 770 similar to 7970

 

Do you think the GTX770 would be a good upgrade over a 7850? (hell, just in case I'm wrong in my memory, I'm going to pretend I have a 7870, and make sure I beat that, even though I'm 75% confident it's a 7850)

Or would you spend the extra $50 and go to a 1050ti?

 

I just checked my config last night, turns out my monitor made it to 78hz, not 84hz like I thought (there is a HUGE difference between 60hz and 78hz; Its amazing to see....).

 

So for safety, I'll say I'd like my card to be able to:

Do 80FPS in all modern games; Droops are OK so long as they stay above 60.

1080p

AA and AF OFF (One advantage to my eye condition, human built in AA)

 

At the moment, the HD7850 manages this, but I'm playing older titles (Bioshock Infinite, DOTA2, Portal2, Tomb Raider [realistic hair off]) and it manages it just perfectly

So I'd be looking for something newer to play the latest A1 titles with friends, like Player Unknown Battlegrounds, for example.

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1050ti is about on par with the 960

for pubg you really want a 1060 or 970 to run higher detail settings

 

maybe wait and see if prices drop a bit if your gpu is still going

this mining craze has to end one day putting a bunch of used cards back on the market

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1050ti is about on par with the 960

for pubg you really want a 1060 or 970 to run higher detail settings

 

maybe wait and see if prices drop a bit if your gpu is still going

this mining craze has to end one day putting a bunch of used cards back on the market

 

It's just so painful at the moment, lol.

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That's an epic build originally, zipties and all!

Perhaps you could get hooked onto a 1050ti and get back to gaming at some decent settings :)

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Well, I managed to pick up a GTX 1060 6GB model, for $250 (second hand).

But of a steal, considering the current 'Mining' price ecosystem......

 

Loaded up some Bioshock Infinite on Ultra with 'Alternate' processing, and wow.... it's gorgeous.

 

Gonna grab a copy of PUBG, and Rise of the Tomb Raider next, and see what's up :)


That's an epic build originally, zipties and all!

Perhaps you could get hooked onto a 1050ti and get back to gaming at some decent settings :)

 

Yeah, I have no idea how those screws actually were so bad.

Must have been a bad batch for them all to snap the head off.

 

I did the same thing with my new card, without problems this time.

 

Nipped the screws up as tight as I could to ensure better contact, and for a blower style card, I'm now seeing 78*C maximum :)

Bloody low temp for a blower card (Asus 1060 Turbo).

 

It's amazing how loose those things ship, every screw on that card got at least another half turn before giving ANY resistance.

I find the same thing on all my hardware though; I got at least a FULL turn on all the cooling on my Motherboard too, before the little springs were even starting to compress.

 

 

Interestingly, back in the early Intel days, when I had one of these bad boys:

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813136066

 

Mine was one of the ONLY boards to not have its VRM's fail under heat load from Overclocking.

I talked to people who had them fail, and yep, all loose heatsinks.

I saw it on mine also, I took the heatsink off to re-paste it, and the heat-pad on the VRM's had almost NO indent at all (one corner didn't have any!)

 

Looking at the blue locktight on the tiny bolts, I'd guess I got another 2 or 3 full turns out of it, when I reapplied.

Suddenly my own personal VRM temps were down from 89*C to 60*C.... hmm....

 

 

I know it's a little off topic, but just a PSA I guess, check your heatsinks are actually tight. Mass production seems to be scared to break them.

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Overtight screws might be the problem as well. And being made of cheap stainless alloy means they're hard and more brittle than normal.

Or maybe some cards just use a faulty design to start with.

Edited by Rybags

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Overtight screws might be the problem as well. And being made of cheap stainless alloy means they're hard and more brittle than normal.

Or maybe some cards just use a faulty design to start with.

 

I'm not torquing the hell out of them, just tightening them until it actually gives a noticeable amount of resistance; as opposed to feeling loose.

 

As I said, I've done it on a LOT of devices, and I'm a bit of a DIY mechanic, so I know roughly what force im putting on something.

 

That old GPU of mine was the cheapest screws I've ever used, pointer finger + thumb strength, from a jewelers screwdriver was enough to snap them.

This ASUS card took a Ph1 screwdriver and tightened down without even blinking.

 

I guess there might be a reason I don't see PowerColor as a popular brand anymore?

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