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Master_Scythe

Phones (not mobile) in cars

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So, I've been trying to find relevant legislation (and I'm sure it's different per state).

But Purely for the purpose of curiosity, I'm trying to find the laws on Car Phones.

 

 

For example, I know it's illegal to use a Mobile Phone in your car while driving.

 

I also know it's NOT illegal to use a CB radio (hence why all my mates and I fitted them for road trips).

 

What's the go with classic VIP level cars with literal phones built into the dashboard\center console.

 

Just genuinely curious.

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They likely predate laws on not using phones in cars.

Also I imagine the majority of them would have been old analog technology so not working for about the last 10 years.

 

I doubt the fact they're built in makes any difference. There's provision for phones in holders that can be touched to use the GPS function. Of course an older phone won't have that anyway. It's sort of like DVD players. Some cars have them built in but in Aus and many places it's illegal for the driver to be able to view footage while the engine's on and that applies to aftermarket self-installed or portable as well.

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i expect we may end up with an extended interim period before cars go fully driverless where the 'driver' is there in a supervisory capacity with the option of manual override — a bit like pilots with auto-pilot.

 

to that end, i would like to see fancy HUDs be the next thing. imagine an intelligent overlay showing road boundaries and tracking moving hazards.

 

then, you could kick back and watch a DVD :)

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They likely predate laws on not using phones in cars.

Also I imagine the majority of them would have been old analog technology so not working for about the last 10 years.

 

To complicate it, lets say I put a modern adaptor of some sort in there.

For example, many of the Lexus exmaples take 2G sim cards (full size).

 

So lets say I found a way to feed 3G; every law I find specifies use of a MOBILE phone.

 

I just enjoy finding loopholes and this caught my interest when my dads mate, who runs a limo service, had a classic phone built into the center.

Edited by Master_Scythe

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The network tech is irrelevant really for the user experience beyond the fact that phone is duplex but CB is simplex and that mobile digital will usually be much better quality at short ranges.

 

Also you could in theory have the same physical user experience with either. Like a mobile handsfree kit with handheld mic or a CB with fixed mic and talk button on a stalk or something.

Whether a handheld mic is allowed for a handsfree phone, NFI.

Edited by Rybags
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I wonder if someone creates a car phone using a mobile tech but the device is attached and powered via the car so it's not actually mobile.

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It's the method of use that matters.

 

Mobile sitting in the console, Bluetooth handfree kit in use is OK.

Mobile sitting in a dash mounted cradle as a GPS device is OK.

Mobile tethered to cig lighter for power being used by hand isn't.

 

The contentious issue though is 2-way radios. You can actually do phone calls by an intermediate service using 2-way radio in some remote areas. So really the main difference is in simplex vs duplex communication.

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Do the laws define what a mobile phone is?

 

Because cars are mobile too right.

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Do the laws define what a mobile phone is?

 

Because cars are mobile too right.

 

Sort of. Its a hella strange ruling on cars.

While they're owned by you, so you're responsible for them, when out in a public location, they're considered public land in as far as police rights go (hence warrant less searching and such in Australia)

So, it's mobile, in that it moves, but whether or not it's considered a phone affixed to private property, or a "Mobile Phone" would be another story.

 

It DOES make me wonder whether Mobile Phone is strictly defined though, yes.

The contentious issue though is 2-way radios. You can actually do phone calls by an intermediate service using 2-way radio in some remote areas. So really the main difference is in simplex vs duplex communication.

 

Yeah, because in QLD, CB radio use is legal while driving.

In Logic, I argue that finding a channel, setting your squelch, if digital setting your sub frequencies\encryption and such is actually MUCH more distracting than making a call on my phone.

But in law, I know, one is illegal, one is not.

And I suppose that, yes, once all those frequencies and such are set up, you're not fiddling much anymore.

 

Still, Holding and releasing a speaker is IMO more distracting than a mobile; but meh, I don't make the laws.

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Car phones were the original mobile phones actually.

 

Well, no argument there, but I havent checked how the current legislation defines a mobile phone.

because if it says a phone that is not permanently affixed, or some such, then, it's not anymore.

Edited by Master_Scythe

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Yeah since the car is also not a fixed location, any phone in it is mobile. Well, if they use that basic definition.

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Quick troll with Uncle Google, could only find this to support 'Scythe's post up here in Bananaland. Not terribly helpful at all...

 

But used to run a AM/SSB CB in both family cars down in NSW a few years ago, at the time was also married into a family of coppers and had this conversation with them over over beers one night

 

The upshot was basically thus - if you get pulled over by the 5-0 (for whatever reason) after being using seen using the two-way whilst mobile and you piss the copper off he/she can start to make your life miserable by doing you for improper control of a motor vehicle.

 

Basically the same ruling used to be able to nail you used for smoking, etc eating etc whilst driving - two hands not on the wheel, quiet night for the copper, add some attitude, Ding!

 

And can attest to this as well - was present a few years later to watch a mate of mine get done on this by being a smart-arse and bad-mouthing the copper. Officer Plod simply raised an eyebrow, shrugged his shoulders, opened his book and retaliated with legal might on his side.

 

Either way, free Public Service Announcement - regardless of why you've been pulled over Do Not Piss The Copper Off.

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Quick troll with Uncle Google, could only find this to support 'Scythe's post up here in Bananaland. Not terribly helpful at all...

 

 

I mean, this bit isn't bad :)

 

"These mobile phone rules do not apply to CB radios or any other two-way radios."

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I bought a set of 2W Oricom handhelds for a recent trip to from Brisbane to Newcastle, as my sister and I were taking our own vehicles. They worked pretty well, as we were never more than 2-3KM apart.

 

It feels odd using them legally while using a mobile is strictly banned.

 

Only trouble we had was to channel hop at one point when there were other people on our channel (we'd worked out our Channel A and Channel B before we set out, so we didn't have to say which channel number to switch to)

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I think cb radios have their own special laws

 

that was the law that had them hijack 27mhz so that they shot down r/c flyers and eventually took over such that am radio moved to 29mhz

 

 

before it went to 40 (72 in 'merica)

 

now it's pretty much all frequency hopping on 2.4ghz

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The problem here is that the confusion comes when you have an object in your hand that you are using to communicate with someone else, whether a phone, CB or anything else. A copper, a friend of mine from High School, and were having this discussion, off the record. It seems, especially here in Queensland, the statutes have not been changed because the politicians havent (thats his word) had the time to get to it yet. So, technically, we are supposed to have both hands on the steering wheel at any time. Technically speaking, if you are communicating with someone hands-free then its legal but frowned upon and, as I understood it, it extends to CBs as well but its up to interpretation of the office in question.

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There has never been a law about having both hands on the steering wheel at all times, just like there's never been a law about wearing [appropriate] shoes while driving.

 

The reason that CB radios can still be used handheld, is that that technology was already in use when the laws were drafted, and they're used by professional drivers and police.

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as I understood it, it extends to CBs as well but its up to interpretation of the office in question.

 

Nope, the law explicitly says it does not.

 

as i quoted earlier

 

"These mobile phone rules do not apply to CB radios or any other two-way radios."

Straight from qld.gov.au themselves.

 

Also driving my manual car, performing handbrake starts, and adjusting my defog settings would be illegal if I had to keep both hands on the wheel.

Also yeah, the shoe thing is stupid; never been a law about shoes.

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At the end of the day, the law says you should be in control of your vehicle at all times. The best way to do this is to reduce distractions to the minimal required to actually operate the vehicle, and not behave in a way that could cause you to lose control. Sometimes this does mean losing those bad habits and picking up good ones.

 

One of my managers only has one arm, yet she's able to drive...

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and not behave in a way that could cause you to lose control.

 

Yeah but it's all just throwing shit at a wall and hoping it only sticks where you want it in the end, isn't it?

 

I mean, due to nothing but a freak mechanical failure (debead), I was thrown off a cliff at 55kph on a 70k road.

And if one of the 'Hoons' happened to take that same corner, and hung the tail end out, the situation would have been near literally impossible to take place.

OTHER events could have, for sure, but that whole "Driving with rules == safety" I'm now convinced is bullshit.

 

I mean, seriously, the amount of close calls and minor (not at fault) accidents I could have avoided if I'd just sped for 10 seconds to get away from an obvious problem driver are ridiculous.

No problem with speeding fines, pull me over, ask me if there was a valid safety reason to be getting away quickly, but cameras are emotionless and logic free, and the constant paranoia they cause are just dangerous.

 

My last minor speeding fine was with a Road-Train tailgating me while an obvious drunk driver is in the next lane.

Just stay there sport, you'll be fine, because this is safer than the 10 seconds of increased speed.

Edited by Master_Scythe
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