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NZT48

All abortion is murder and should be treated under law the same as any other murder.

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9 hours ago, fliptopia said:

I don't know that it's the sort of thing a lot of people would think they would do til they realised they wanted it.

My point precisely. And yet she comes out with her opinion as not seeing herself take that path 😕 I don't doubt most feel that way ...

 

9 hours ago, fliptopia said:

So the question seems unnecessarily personal and provocative. 

No, it shows the level of empathy and openness for the vagaries of others lives. We seem pretty open about giving our views on most topics all in the hopes of leading humanity out of the dark days of the past. I don't see why this should be any different

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3 hours ago, eveln said:

 

No, it shows the level of empathy and openness for the vagaries of others lives. We seem pretty open about giving our views on most topics all in the hopes of leading humanity out of the dark days of the past. I don't see why this should be any different

 

Why does that opinion have to be about what you would do for you? Why not whether you think there are reasons why it might be appropriate for an abortion or something along those lines? You could be open to abortion and not feel it's something you would do so the second question seems to cover the first but cover more bases. 

 

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Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, fliptopia said:

 

Why does that opinion have to be about what you would do for you? Why not whether you think there are reasons why it might be appropriate for an abortion or something along those lines? You could be open to abortion and not feel it's something you would do so the second question seems to cover the first but cover more bases. 

 

I guess cos it's a pretty obvious question to ask a female. - I'm on my phone, it's a pain to go back and open the link - Gladys makes a bit of a bother about having to answer and then imo, almost implies she wouldn't end up in the position of needing to figure out whether she would abort. That of course could be for any number of reasons, none of which she needs to give ... I don't see why the initial hesitancy was there ... It was silly.

Edited by eveln

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Posted (edited)

" Berejiklian: My personal view is I'm a very conservative person who would not feel comfortable in having that process, but that is just me, and it's not fair for me … and Ben, you've been naughty in pushing me to say that, because I don't want anyone to feel guilty about decisions they've made, because I'm not in their shoes. "

 

No. Just no.

You see I was mis-remembering her comment and being nicer about it than I should have. What the fuck has being conservative got to do with abortion ???  I love how these people don't think about the picture of a person deciding whether or not to abort.

Suddenly these females are Socialists cos their personal circumstance requires an abortion ???? Holy fuck how small minded is that ?! And more than likely there are quite a few fucking conservatives out there who have had to have an abortion

Mein Gott !!

 

Again, what about all those who've had legal hysterectomys and vasectomys ... should they be feeling guilty too ffs

Edited by eveln

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11 minutes ago, eveln said:

" Berejiklian: My personal view is I'm a very conservative person who would not feel comfortable in having that process, but that is just me, and it's not fair for me … and Ben, you've been naughty in pushing me to say that, because I don't want anyone to feel guilty about decisions they've made, because I'm not in their shoes. "

 

No. Just no.

You see I was mis-remembering her comment and being nicer about it than I should have. What the fuck has being conservative got to do with abortion ???  I love how these people don't think about the picture of a person deciding whether or not to abort.

Suddenly these females are Socialists cos their personal circumstance requires an abortion ???? Holy fuck how small minded is that ?! And more than likely there are quite a few fucking conservatives out there who have had to have an abortion

Mein Gott !!

 

Again, what about all those who've had legal hysterectomys and vasectomys ... should they be feeling guilty too ffs

 

There in lies part of the problem of speaking of every issue in terms of left/right/progressive/conservative etc

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36 minutes ago, fliptopia said:

 

There in lies part of the problem of speaking of every issue in terms of left/right/progressive/conservative etc

Really !? I'd say All of the problem  ffs

What is so difficult in just answering the question ? No body really bloody knows till the the process is put forward as a solution . Why should that be such a difficult thing to say ?

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30 minutes ago, eveln said:

Really !? I'd say All of the problem  ffs

What is so difficult in just answering the question ? No body really bloody knows till the the process is put forward as a solution . Why should that be such a difficult thing to say ?

 

Maybe because the question is so loaded and not expected. Add to that the way every answer any polition gives is analysed, especially on hot button issues like this currently is. I'd probably take a moment. She is trying to find a way to tow the conservative party line while not alienating the other other side. I imagine the answer worked for some people and not others. 

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26 minutes ago, fliptopia said:

 

Maybe because the question is so loaded and not expected. Add to that the way every answer any polition gives is analysed, especially on hot button issues like this currently is. I'd probably take a moment. She is trying to find a way to tow the conservative party line while not alienating the other other side. I imagine the answer worked for some people and not others.  

If the question is loaded, then the way to defuse it is to just answer it as simply and as honestly as possible. Gladys is a fool for trying to be political and so she fails

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The head of a political party and head of a government is a fool for trying to be political?  Everything she does is probably political, at least in the public sphere.

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Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, eveln said:

" Berejiklian: My personal view is I'm a very conservative person who would not feel comfortable in having that process, but that is just me, and it's not fair for me … and Ben, you've been naughty in pushing me to say that, because I don't want anyone to feel guilty about decisions they've made, because I'm not in their shoes. "

 

No. Just no.

You see I was mis-remembering her comment and being nicer about it than I should have. What the fuck has being conservative got to do with abortion ???  I love how these people don't think about the picture of a person deciding whether or not to abort.

Suddenly these females are Socialists cos their personal circumstance requires an abortion ???? Holy fuck how small minded is that ?! And more than likely there are quite a few fucking conservatives out there who have had to have an abortion

Mein Gott !!

 

Again, what about all those who've had legal hysterectomys and vasectomys ... should they be feeling guilty too ffs

 

woah, youve latched onto that one word and gone mental haha

 

she didnt say, "I'm a very conservative person politically...". 

 

she probably meant conservative of temperament (since terminating your own pregnancy is an extreme intervention) and conservative sexually (because a no sex before marriage lifestyle choice tends to be very effective at eliminating all but the most unthinkable scenarios for an unwanted pregnancy).

 

while its safe to assume 99% of social "conservatives" are "conservatives" politically, that does not mean the word is interchangeable and connotations within context can be overlooked.  its also safe to assume theres a fair proportion of sexually promiscuous atheists who happen to be conservative voters, so it should be pretty fricken obvious that the main thrust of her comment was not to invoke an association with the entirety of those on the right of politics. 

 

moreover, with her answers, she was pretty much doing the exact opposite of what youre accusing her of! she resisted offering a personal view, repeatedly downplayed its supposed relevance, and generally displayed a level of reluctance befitting someone with a healthy respect for the separation between church and state.  so who is she trying to make feel guilty?  

 

first she said
"I don't want to make people feel guilty who have had to go down that path."

 

later she said
"Ben, you've been naughty in pushing me to say that, because I don't want anyone to feel guilty about decisions they've made, because I'm not in their shoes."

 

oh, i see it now.  it must have been the last bit that set you off: "...not in their shoes".  she was clearly echoing the famous aphorism that says we should cast hasty judgments on people with different life circumstances.  i see your point now.

 

by the way, just as an aside, when she says "I've not been in a situation where I've had to contemplate that, and nor would I", i totally believe her.  being someone who grew up as a god-fearing christian, theres every chance she knows to take precautions whenever she rolls over for Alan Jones.

 

Edited by @~thehung
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4 hours ago, @~thehung said:

she didnt say, "I'm a very conservative person politically...". 

She's on the radio show as the Premier ffs. Of course it's political.

 

by the way, I bloody love that clip, you know when I was writing that bit about conservative women having had abortions there was something naggin' at me  ... and your post of that clip solved the nag . lol.

 

4 hours ago, @~thehung said:

 

she probably meant conservative of temperament (since terminating your own pregnancy is an extreme intervention)

again, you can think you're conservative till the cows come home, but when and if you are faced with the question is the telling point. but as I initially inferred, ya just don't know till ya have to Know

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5 hours ago, Nich... said:

The head of a political party and head of a government is a fool for trying to be political?  Everything she does is probably political, at least in the public sphere.

A good politician is imo, doesn't actually need to cover all the bases all the time, their opinions after all, are what got them where they are, yes ?

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2 hours ago, eveln said:

A good politician is imo, doesn't actually need to cover all the bases all the time, their opinions after all, are what got them where they are, yes ?

 

I'd say a good politician is one that sticks what people voted them in for and at the same time realises that they still have to govern to include those that didn't vote for them because most that's fairly close to half the voters. 

 

And sure, sometimes you aren't going to cover all bases and she often doesn't. I'd rather have someone who thinks and then speaks than the other way around. 

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, fliptopia said:

 

I'd say a good politician is one that sticks what people voted them in for and at the same time realises that they still have to govern to include those that didn't vote for them because most that's fairly close to half the voters. 

 

And sure, sometimes you aren't going to cover all bases and she often doesn't. I'd rather have someone who thinks and then speaks than the other way around. 

I'd say a good politician is one that actually believed in the things that got them the vote ... I think we might have differing ideas on how a good pollie should be 😉 

 

@Nich... I did laugh, but it's just so simple ain't it

Edited by eveln

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50 minutes ago, eveln said:

I'd say a good politician is one that actually believed in the things that got them the vote ... I think we might have differing ideas on how a good pollie should be 😉 

 

@Nich... I did laugh, but it's just so simple ain't it

 

Haha. Sorry I did make the assumption that my good pollie platformed on something they believed in. I'd say there are differences but maybe not worlds apart. 

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