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nickeax

Farmers That Need Help.

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Are farms different from other commercial enterprises? Let's say a musician wanted ever so much to make a living from writing and releasing their material, but they couldn't sell enough to do that. The factors thwarting them may me more than just the quality of their output. How much aid should that musician receive?

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Music is the balm to life. But we would survive without it. We do need the arts to 'round' us out, but there would be nothing to round out without the farmers

so I'm not sure how much aid musicians should get

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Really, it's a privelage and not a right to be able to live on and work on your own land profitably.

I wonder why they bother, but of course the attraction of having no neighbour in eyesight and the other peaceful aspects of it all...

But yeah, it seem we're always assisting someone and the paybacks don't seem so great.  Look how the car industry just bailed totally.
The alternative though isn't particularly nice - nasty food imports and the Chinese just buying adjoining farms outright and wanting to import their own workforce to work them.

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It really depends on how much something qualifies as an "essential industry".  The car industry used to be viewed this way - i.e. could Australia survive a war that blockaded us from importing cars?  For some reason it's no longer viewed that way.

*shrug* Beats me.  Farmers have it pretty good I reckon.  The main thing is that whomever should take over a failed farm, anti-trust laws should be upheld so no one gets a monopoly and abuses the economy.  But the government is notoriously bad at challenging violators of anti-trust laws.

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4 hours ago, Rybags said:

Really, it's a privelage and not a right to be able to live on and work on your own land profitably.

The privilege is to own the land, and to make profit.  Serfs do not want to be farmers.  Hell, most kids of farmers do not want to be farmers!

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Most Aussie farmers aren't rich, they have lots of assets but the cash flow is a different matter. They are rich they have a lot of assets (the farm, farm equipment) but don't swim in cash. If it's one of corporate farms then that's a completely different matter.

Edited by Jeruselem

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I don't know much about farming, but surely its important to take into account a wider range of factors than simply looking at cost/profit, such as wider international market forces, environmental impact, the effects the local supermarket behemoths have on farm productivity and profitability, and what types of crops are subsidised?

Same as with any cultural actitivities, such as music - if only considered from a cost/profit viewpoint, no-one would do it, and the follow on effects of that would be greater than simply having nothing to listen to.

Edited by komuso
speeling
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Farming is affected by so much - quarantine issues with exotic pests and diseases, constant pest control,  international trade, your market and buyers, weather, local disasters, how horrible the supermarkets treat you, etc. You might be best farmer in the area but if some fwit starts throwing sanctions around and collapses your market, what to do?

Edited by Jeruselem

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6 hours ago, komuso said:

I don't know much about farming, but surely its important to take into account a wider range of factors than simply looking at cost/profit, such as wider international market forces, environmental impact, the effects the local supermarket behemoths have on farm productivity and profitability, and what types of crops are subsidised?

Same as with any cultural actitivities, such as music - if only considered from a cost/profit viewpoint, no-one would do it, and the follow on effects of that would be greater than simply having nothing to listen to.

Oh yessirre. Without music we'd be bland. Without farms we'd be pretty fucking bland too

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Not every farm in every area needs subsidies, IIRC.

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Got to sympathise in certain ways though... screwed over by so many competitors.

China with almost slave labour expenses and dumping on every possible export market.  The US with subsides all over the place, fuel included, as if they need more help for that.

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Gold farming is certainly not an easy job. Well, maybe it's pretty easy but it can be a bit boring at times. Hopefully this money will help those guys out, too.

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was reading a bit about African sheep being farmed here. They're apparently a hardier beast, being used to dry conditions. Being adaptable will help lessen a farmer's need for subsidies, as long as the chosen stock can deal with not eating for a few months is all :\

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9 minutes ago, eveln said:

African sheep

Good luck with that.  I mean, it could be a solution for mutton/lamb production, but... The world wants Superfine, and that comes from Australian Merino.

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Just now, Cybes said:

Good luck with that.  I mean, it could be a solution for mutton/lamb production, but... The world wants Superfine, and that comes from Australian Merino.

Well yes. Also I was wondering what the winter coat of an African sheep was like, because again merino wool is extremely sort after . But these says it's more about the dollar and prolly some accountant thinks people will get to like it ( african lamb) when there be no other choice

accountants do that shit all the time it's why they make lousy owners of business

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On 11/8/2018 at 8:26 PM, eveln said:

was reading a bit about African sheep being farmed here. They're apparently a hardier beast, being used to dry conditions. Being adaptable will help lessen a farmer's need for subsidies, as long as the chosen stock can deal with not eating for a few months is all :\

Be very careful with the breeds.  Pretty sure the main African breed in Aus is the Dorper which is a meat sheep, no good at all for wool.

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29 minutes ago, aliali said:

Be very careful with the breeds.  Pretty sure the main African breed in Aus is the Dorper which is a meat sheep, no good at all for wool.

re the underlined P: I thought from the pics I'd seen that would be the case. And yeah need to try telling the money dudes about being careful of introducing random anything into an established procedure

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The Merino breed originated and was further refined here for it's adaptability to conditions and quality of it's wool.

Sheep for meat - I have NFI what goes on there.  At times you can go to wholesalers in rural areas here at times and buy half a carcass for 25 bucks or less if you're willing to process it yourself.
Yet go into any supermarket and you're still paying over $20 a kg for racks/cutlets and near double the price of pork for a leg.

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Spain originally I think ...edit :

http://merinos.com.au/genetics/merino-history/australian-merino

" The Australian Merino is not a single homogenous breed but a number of ‘strains’ of sheep all of which, regardless of their origins, are uniquely Australian. The major factor determining the Merino’s development has been the requirement for environmental suitability. Very few, if any, domestic animals in this or any other country have shown such resilience or responded with such versatility and success to Australia’s enormous variations in climatic conditions, management and husbandry techniques. By skilful breeding and selection, the pioneer breeders set down the foundation of the Australian Merino ... "

Imagine the time headaches in trying to get it right back then ...

 

Edited by eveln
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9 minutes ago, Rybags said:

The Merino breed originated and was further refined here for it's adaptability to conditions and quality of it's wool.

Sheep for meat - I have NFI what goes on there

There are Merino meat variants around. Sort of a dual purpose animal, reasonable fleece and reasonable meat. These seem to be mainly the SAAM breed (South African Meat Merino) but no idea on their numbers over here.

Meat breeds are Poll Dorset, Suffolk, White Suffolk and Dorper. Again not sure on ratios per breed, having trouble finding any relevant numbers even on the MLA website.

The pure meat ones are reasonably easy to distinguish from the wool varieties due to the short wool and blocky builds with some of them built like the proverbial brick shithouse.

 

EG

071209.jpg

Note that not all Dorpers have a black head.

26 minutes ago, Rybags said:

At times you can go to wholesalers in rural areas here at times and buy half a carcass for 25 bucks or less if you're willing to process it yourself.
Yet go into any supermarket and you're still paying over $20 a kg for racks/cutlets and near double the price of pork for a leg.

Possible the half a sheep is a lower quality carcass and of course chopping it up and making it in to nice packages for the supermarkets does cost, but the markup between farmer and consumer does seem excessive.

Of course the supermarkets would never rip the farmers and consumers off would they? Nah silly idea corporations always have our best interests at heart.

/S

 

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I would venture that it isn't premium.  Likely the good stuff is farmed near the coast where rainfall is more reliable.  Around here it's not so much that way.  Still plenty of sheep and cattle around though the density is usually not real high.
The local milk is often a good indicator.  The stuff from places like Bega and Bodalla craps all over what Canberra produces.  Have to say the local milk here is pretty woeful.

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