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Kimmo

Anyone know much about power conditioners?

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3 hours ago, stadl said:

An earthed appliance does not just mean an appliance with a metal case connected to earth. The protective earth may be present in an internal chassis or PCB - so long as an earth is present, these filters will offer their designed protection.

 

sure.  my confusion was the ambiguity of that device's pins, and wanting to be careful about the prospect of you unintentionally seeming to advocate for the disconnection of the TV's earth, in the event it was actually earthed.

 

@Kimmo, since "This shitbox thing isn't earthed" it must have a floating ground reference.  theres probably an inverter inside producing very high AC voltages with respect to the "0V" present at the fattest copper traces of the power board and ground plane. 

 

i have NFI what potential might exist between the TV's faux "0V" and earth, but connecting them together would be a very bad idea. 

 

"He died in his La-Z-Boy, Kentucky death-row inmate style, the over-ear headphones which had delivered the lethal shock from a faulty television set, now fused to the still smoking melted flesh of his face" :D

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So here's a wrinkle - the missus just switched on the bedroom light (I think I half-remembered turning on lights will do it, hence some reluctance to faff around checking different circuits - any circuit will do it), and the telly went blank for a few seconds, as it does, and then it did this other thing I didn't already mention, cause it never coincided before. INVALID FORMAT, it tells me, until I change inputs back and forth.

 

Yeah, that's a thing it sometimes does when  I turn it on. Sometimes it also does other crazy shit, like display blue as pink, or squash everything to the left while mucking up the colours and going fuzzy; presumably as a result of not recognising the input format... that's pretty rare, though.

 

Oh yeah, it also does this other thing, where it'll flicker, a bit like losing the V-hold on a CRT, where momentarily I'll see bits of the lower part of the frame in the top half of the screen. It just did that before, for the first time coinciding with going blank, making me wonder if it's part of the same problem...

 

I suppose this is what I get for paying $0.00004 a pixel.

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Sounds like a right shitbox TV.

 

Invalid format might be it thinking a video stream is something it can't handle, like e.g. the earliest digital gear only did SD and would whine about HD.  Then everything went HD compatible but it'd whine about H.264 which has been in use for probably 3-4 years now.

But generally a tuner when it suffers a glitch should recover within a few seconds, though some really nasty ones can actually lockup and need a powerdown to fix them.

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I actually know a LOT about these things, because I used to sell (con?... nah a lot of it was real, but there certainly was SOME placebo...) 'Elitist HiFi gear'.

We're talking "If you don't have $30k, and you want a 2.0 stereo, you're in the wrong shop".

 

Anywho, the TLDR is that most of the power conditioners are bogus, but there ARE a few that actually do their thing.

 

There was this neat device that was basically a speaker, connected to an AC power plug, with a crossover set at 50~60hz (where our power is meant to be).

Anything outside of that, would work, well,  just like AC waves into a speaker do.

Loud, horrible, distorted buzzing.

 

It was actually interesting to me to be able to go to each of our different brand power boards and see which ones kept power\noise out of the circuit.

And while anything compact (class D) was pure placebo, and most Tube amps 'filter' themselves by design; 

some of those Class A\B amplifiers that run on direct AC voltage, did in fact care noticeably if the power was clean.

 

 

ANYWAY, about the only brand that cleaned it 100% was THOR.

Coincidentally, they made the speaker device also, but it certainly worked (I was able to find other boards that were also silent).

 

Out "Really good shit" used to run off of a PS20

https://www.thortechnologies.com.au/product-category/power/

But you do NOT want a $2k filter for a $500 TV now do ya 😛

 

The solution to our customers turning their noses up to that, was their passive range;

 

https://www.rio.com.au/product/b8f-power-board-thor/?adTribesID=24dbad984f963486b5916a99cbeadb57|adtribes|7149&utm_source=Google Shopping&utm_campaign=Google Shopping&utm_medium=cpc&utm_term=7149&utm_content=HJFeed&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIjK_Q55XH4wIVg4BwCh1QSwf0EAQYASABEgLoU_D_BwE

 

Those "Smart Filter" power boards were killer.

Silenced my little speaker tool, and took the "Max volume hum" out of the Class A\B amps.

 

Benefit of those power boards is that that usually filter COAX as well; so you can get SOME protection from indirect lightning strikes, and if things like light switches are killing the TV, it'll also filter any noise getting into the 'ground' of your house.

 

 

 

Worth a note; I get nothing out of this nowadays, and it wasn't that company whom I worked for (they've since closed down); so it's nothing but the fact that they gave me a tool to test them, and was impressed.

Edited by Master_Scythe
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@Kimmo Radio Rentals is clearing a few different Thor smart filter boards ATM on ebay, I grabbed a Smart Filter 8 for $30, RRP is around $250 and online rarely better than $180.

 

Waiting for them to arrive, Aus Post is using the interstate tortoise system again 😄

 

Edit: I also ordered a 2x Thor E145s Smart Surge Protector and 2x Smart Duo two plug boards. These all use some level of EMI/RFI noise filtering, the higher end models usually have more filtering, the Smart 8 has 8 sockets with a separate filter for each bank of 2 plug sockets.

 

I may not plug my hifi valve amp plugged into one of these if it reduces dynamics as some have found, but for everything else I will.

 

 

Edited by datafast69
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At retail prices maybe, especially when looking at the higher end boards like the IsoTek ones (would still mean a cheap ass TV), but a Thor when being cleared at 30 bucks each.

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OK, these things do clean incoming power, on my PC system the Dell screen has a slightly improved image in clarity and colour vibrancy with the Thor....subjectively.

 

With my hifi system (custom made EL34 PP Triode strapped valve amp, modified Marantz CD-60 and Lenehan ML-1 mini monitors) there is a little more subtle detail apparent but with my valve amp plugged in there is a bit less weight to the presentation *shrug* Sound is maybe subjectively more refined with the Thor.

 

Edit: I'm thinking the more I listen with a Thor Duo, I think the perceived loss of weight or dynamics to music is the result of reduced bloom.

 

More likely is that while these things are OK at continuous current draw, they are not so good with dynamic current draw as with power amps, so this is why even though my valve amp has a heap of filtering in It's power supply it is restricted by the power board as it doesn't pass the dynamic swings of current when required.

20191118_142320.jpg.82ab902c7d452a6da6c34af298a4859a.jpg

20191118_142341.jpg.f8223e022ec0db8f43e668521e84769f.jpg

Edited by datafast69

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On 11/15/2019 at 10:30 PM, LogicprObe said:

 

Wouldn't it be cheaper to get a new tele?

 

Got a new telly. 55" UHD Viano. $300, so I've got another in the man cave. 

 

Guess what? This POS does the same shit. Might have to see about one of those Thors @datafast69 put me onto. 

 

...Actually come to think of it, it's only the one in the shed. Maybe I should swap em around so the good one's on the PS4.

Edited by Kimmo
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27 minutes ago, Kimmo said:

 

Got a new telly. 55" UHD Viano. $300, so I've got another in the man cave. 

 

Guess what? This POS does the same shit. Might have to see about one of those Thors @datafast69 put me onto. 

 

...Actually come to think of it, it's only the one in the shed. Maybe I should swap em around so the good one's on the PS4.

If you only have the PS4 and TV you could grab 2x Thor Duo's, two plug ones and daisy chain those two, for twice the filtering, I did this for my CD Player, but my amp needs unfiltered as it requires transient demands a filtered board can't give, so it gets plugged into the non filtered board.

 

Note: never use more devices than one board is made for, safety first.

 

Burt you get the idea, and they are only 10 bucks each.

20191119_170032.jpg.4ea05a0de945483a5b27

 

 

Edited by datafast69

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The 8x plug board has features the Duo's don't like coax for tv antenna and filters and protects a little better, and the 4x plug boards have fast USB charging which the 8 plug board doesn't.

 

The Thor website in MS's post is good for checking features.

 

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17 hours ago, LogicprObe said:

 

Geeze!

I've been away so long I didn't  know that Kimmo had joined the economy!

Good on you, mate!

 

Um, I've been in the workforce since 1992.

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Maybe don't pay so much attention to the slanderous shit dribblings of our local billionaire fluffer...

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As long as you aren't a cross dressing politician like Pauline Hanson, you are OK in my books, Kimmo 😎

 

Yes, I do have standards.

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Everyone's okay in my book, except the scum bleeding society dry, and their snivelling apologists. 

 

Oh, and I'm not sure what it is about most folks who drove a Camry, but it'd sure be nice if they were only allowed out on Sundays, like in the Good Old Days. 

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On 11/20/2019 at 3:31 PM, Kimmo said:

Oh, and I'm not sure what it is about most folks who drove a Camry, but it'd sure be nice if they were only allowed out on Sundays, like in the Good Old Days. 

 

Unless it's one of those darn new ones circa 2016 or so, bastards are quick!

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