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NSW / QLD fires

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2 hours ago, Leonid said:


All of that sounds like pissing into the wind for that is what you’d be doing if you pretend we (Australia) can do something to stop climate change.

 

Because global climate change is a China problem. All western states are either not increasing emissions or slowly dropping.

The mind set you choose is one that perpetuates the problem, It's called.... the blame game.

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13 hours ago, Leonid said:

But it’s a really shitty thing to say nonetheless.

 

Something more intelligent might have been - it’s likely the two lives lost were Greens voters and I think it about time the Greens Party started educating their voters in balancing their environmental considerations with the understanding that people live in the environment and that in the absence of any hope of averting climate change, sensible countermeasures need to be taken so that people don’t die in wholly predictable events in Australia’s outback.

 

no.  1. mentioning what kind of voters they may have been is a hard fail.  2. tacking on a non sequitur, even were it not fraudulent, couldnt raise the intelligence level above zero.  dumb + dumb smart. 

 

in the presence of climate change sensible countermeasures need to be taken that extend beyond mere backburning which is only possible during shrinking windows of time due to the deteriorating conditions.  SloMo actually meeting with Greg Mullins would be a start.

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Backburning isn't riskless, a friend of mine with a rural block has had a few close calls when the firies were backburning and left it unattended, and it gets out of control destroying people's property. These are the volunteers doing this, and he knows they can be f*ing drunk while working.

Edited by Jeruselem

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38 minutes ago, Jeruselem said:

Backburning isn't riskless, a friend of mine with a rural block has had a few close calls when the firies were backburning and left it unattended, and it gets out of control destroying people's property. These are the volunteers doing this, and he knows they can be f*ing drunk while working.

Doesn't sound like a controlled back burn at all ! Sounds more like drunken fools lighting fires . ffs

 

@@~thehung um, not at all a hard fail for a pollie to use politics to show a point of reasoning.

Surely ? 

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Backburning can be a bit Catch 22.

 

In WA it was a standing joke, they'd backburn down south or inland, the wind would change the fire would continue to burn, harmlessly usually, and Perth would be under a pall of smoke for days.

 

They did get better, especially at having the Drover bombers on standby but so far as I know it still happens every few years.

 

Cheers

 

 

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Cool, my bro is in Adelaide onward bound for Whyalla and a well deserved break 🙂

 

Cheers

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It's a problem with choppers, possibly why I don't like them much - you really cannot relax, think of it as being a dynamically unstable device, that would be not far from the truth. In all the confusion and the heat it is not at all difficult to make a small mistake and have that sort of an outcome. He was lucky.

 

Helicopters get used a lot for water bombing and they are effective so far as it goes, especially in terms of being able to grab water most anywhere, even out of pools. But they are less stable than a fixed wing aircraft in those twisty winds that appear around big fires.

 

Not from personal experience, just from reading about it recently in "Air and Space" magazine with respect to the California fires.

 

You are going to get tired of my saying it - we need real water bombers.

 

Cheers

 

 

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4 hours ago, datafast69 said:

The mind set you choose is one that perpetuates the problem, It's called.... the blame game.


The blame is easily attributable.

No western countries are growing emissions. Only China and India are.

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The accumulation of GHGs is not some overnight phenomenon Leo, they have been growing in the atmosphere for well over a century.

 

Chemically it is inevitable that they would, CO2 with an atomic weight of 22 is so close to the "clean" atmosphere mix of oxygen and nitrogen, that it is not going to escape the way much maligned hydrogen, or often disregarded helium does. Neither will methane, CH4, although it is lighter at an  atomic weight of 10 (using atomic weights for simplicity.)

 

Methane tends to head into the ionosphere, CO2 not so high but both are overall very thinly spread. Unfortunately that doesn't matter much, the effect is to act as a "mirror" that tends to restrict, I wont say trap or it would be all over by now, heat within the atmosphere leading over time to a net increase of a few degrees.

 

The reality is far more complex - Gaia is not a simplistic creature  - but suffice to say that we humans have been contributing to the imbalance on a continual basis since the dawn of the industrial age. Somewhat less recognised is the to be blunt accumulation of methane from cow farts, we do farm a LOT of cattle.

 

So we as emergent industrial nations, especially in the northern hemisphere ,have been just as guilty over decades as China and India are now as they emerge.

 

In other words get off the grass blaming it all on China and India, at least they are doing something as NASA has found.

 

We need a massive increase in carbon sinks as well as cutting back on emissions and whilst we are about it cleaning up the oceans would help as well. Seawater is not a widely recognised sink at all but when 70% of your planet is covered by it it is a factor and bloody great rafts of plastic in mid-Pacific do not help.

 

We for all our arrogance do not understand the total mechanism at all, the best we can do as we learn more is to adjust the levers - reduce emissions, increase sinks, stop with bloody stupid number like "carbon offsets" and get ready for a rocky ride.

 

Earth will endure, probably our species will as well, but succeeding generations are going to have to learn to live in better harmony with the earth cycle.

 

Cheers

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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54 minutes ago, Leonid said:


The blame is easily attributable.

No western countries are growing emissions. Only China and India are.

So that's your excuse for us to do nothing.

 

Good on you, Leo.

 

Edit: while also confirming it is the blame game, and you apparently think that you know better than most of the worlds scientists, taking such a stance. Maybe it is influenced by your political ideologies and leanings, supporter of the Coal-alition are we? no secret that they and a big chunk of their supporters place the almighty dollar ahead of the environment....a lot of science deniers among them.

 

We are still contributing to co2 emissions, and doing too little over all across the board to help the situation, and you think we should do nothing.

Edited by datafast69

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Of course it is, Leo is not just anti-communist he is anti- socialism and makes little distinction between them and he doesn't seem to have much respect for India either.

 

Confusing country is India but they do buy Migs, maybe that is enough to twitch the anti- communist funny bone...

 

In the end Leo it is getting to be a rather crowded planet we need to learn to get along, not keep blaming each other.

 

Cheers

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1 hour ago, datafast69 said:

So that's your excuse for us to do nothing.


I’m a huge believer in doing nothing when doing something is useless and wasteful.

 

It’s not a blame game because a game suggests there’s blame to go around. There isn’t.

 

Global Climate Change is a China problem. And my standing as a sometimes coalition voter doesn’t change that.

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43 minutes ago, chrisg said:

Of course it is, Leo is not just anti-communist he is anti- socialism and makes little distinction between them and he doesn't seem to have much respect for India either.

 

Confusing country is India but they do buy Migs, maybe that is enough to twitch the anti- communist funny bone...

 

In the end Leo it is getting to be a rather crowded planet we need to learn to get along, not keep blaming each other.

 

Cheers

Yup, twice as many folk now compared to the 70's on this rock.

 

Funny enough there is half the rest of other animals by numbers inhabiting the planet since the 70's, of course there is no cause correlation there (damn, can't find a sarcasm emoji)

 

Yes, we do need to get along and cooperate for the benefit of us all, and hate doesn't work.

1 minute ago, Leonid said:


I’m a huge believer in doing nothing when doing something is useless and wasteful.

 

It’s not a blame game because a game suggests there’s blame to go around. There isn’t.

 

Global Climate Change is a China problem. And my standing as a sometimes coalition voter doesn’t change that.

It's everyone on the planets problem as it effect us all.

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10 minutes ago, Leonid said:

Global Climate Change is a China problem. And my standing as a sometimes coalition voter doesn’t change that.

 

if they had a separate globe it would be their problem

 

but last time i looked out the window (at a large plume of smoke on the northern horizon), it appeared we were all under the same atmosphere

 

 

considering it to be a local problem is a little like stating nazism was a german problem... when something gains momentum it's unavoidable to be dragged in

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@Leonid Mate, you were an lot more chilled and centered back in the day here, seem so bitter these days in comparison, sincerely hope all is OK for you.

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Back burning is done DURING a bushfire to starve it of fuel ahead of its path in an attempt to stop it gathering momentum.

Hazard reduction burning is done BEFORE the fire starts, in times of the year when weather conditions are favourable outside of the bushfire season.

 

Know your burns.

 

 

 

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8 minutes ago, twinair said:

Back burning is done DURING a bushfire to starve it of fuel ahead of its path in an attempt to stop it gathering momentum.

Hazard reduction burning is done BEFORE the fire starts, in times of the year when weather conditions are favourable outside of the bushfire season.

 

Know your burns.

 

 

 

tenor.gif.7dfb3826e8ff63d94c1c04bb0270ae41.gif

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2 hours ago, datafast69 said:

@Leonid Mate, you were an lot more chilled and centered back in the day here, seem so bitter these days in comparison, sincerely hope all is OK for you.

Crikey I remember the tail end of some battles involving lots of differing folk ...chaos it was, some of it hate filled to overflowing . Seems mild now and more focused really 😉

Edited by eveln
tail not tale
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1 minute ago, eveln said:

Crikey I remember the tail end of some battles involving lots of differing folk ...chaos it was, some of it hate filled to overflowing . Seems mild now and more focused really 😉

In the whole, well yeah 🤣

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2 hours ago, datafast69 said:

tenor.gif.7dfb3826e8ff63d94c1c04bb0270ae41.gif

🙂

 

 

Actually a completely correct call, we get sloppy on nomenclature .

 

The theory is to burn off fuel when it is "safe" to do so, that's hazard burning, sometimes they get it wrong.

 

Back burning is an attempt to deny the fire of fuel and stop it in its tracks.

 

Decades of use would suggest that it depends upon the strength of the fire and the direction of the wind. When the fire is so fierce that spot fires are happening miles down wind it is not likely to be terribly successful but it may allow firefighters to focus on spots.

 

It all depends upon how dry everything is and from what I gather it is very dry just now.

 

Actually Twinny, I've never looked and won't to see where you live but believe it or not I have been concerned about you the past few days, if you are where I surmise you are it must be a concern.

 

Cheers

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3 minutes ago, chrisg said:

 

Actually a completely correct call, we get sloppy on nomenclature .

really dude, but you sounded like you knew what you were saying a few posts up there, and would have let it stand if twinair had not posted. now you're just trying too hard

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🙂

 

 No, when it comes to fires I know what I read and nothing  much more.

 

People have been sloppy for a long, long time and calling "hazard burning: "back burning" is all.

 

However a lot of firefighters I would bet muddle it up, especially the volunteers - in fact some may never had heard the term "hazard burning."

 

It's semantics but sensible semantics because the intents are very different.

 

Cheers

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Oops, I was really referring to hazard burning earlier. Still it stands it's done by stupid drunks who go the pub after leaving an active site in some cases.

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35 minutes ago, chrisg said:

However a lot of firefighters I would bet muddle it up, especially the volunteers - in fact some may never had heard the term "hazard burning."

 

36 minutes ago, chrisg said:

 No, when it comes to fires I know what I read and nothing  much more.

what the fuck

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