Vowel deeds are afoot in modern Strayan

[eveln 1,404]

8 hours ago, fliptopia said:

None of those have vowels after the g

I know. And it frustrates my logic that the vowel after the single g changes the pronunciation of the vowel before the g, but it does none of that with a gg  ... but there you have it. rules without, imo, sound logic

[fliptopia 515]

2 hours ago, eveln said:

I know. And it frustrates my logic that the vowel after the single g changes the pronunciation of the vowel before the g, but it does none of that with a gg  ... but there you have it. rules without, imo, sound logic

 

Logic in English? I wouldn't be trying to find that.

[Cybes 1,433]

7 hours ago, @~thehung said:

if you feel like you say them differently, you probably do, because you hear the differences

 

Indeed.  That's not an indication of 'direction', though.  eg: for years I heard prominent swapping of the 'eh' and 'a' sound from the Eastern states ("alectronic celculators") - not so much since the Kath & Kim "effluent" skit.  Pretty sure none of those folks were aware of the drift beforehand.

[eveln 1,404]

49 minutes ago, fliptopia said:

 

Logic in English? I wouldn't be trying to find that.

ummm, a wee play on the " sound" logic ...;) 

[SquallStrife 606]

15 hours ago, @~thehung said:

 

you mean beg-a like "begger" right? 

in australia, its like Bega (cheese), ie. Seger (Bob)

 

the correct latin american pronunciation of the surname Vega (eg. Suzanne Vega) is closest to "bair-gah", which americans process as "vay-gah". in silicon valley especially, they were always destined to do the same with SEGA.

 

americans do some weird shit.  they dont really have the short 'o' in Carlos like we do.  their 'loss' is a hybrid of 'loss'/'lahss'.  so their only other option to make Carlos with familiar sounds is use their long 'o' and make a meal of the last syllable - carl-OSE

 

 

When they entered the Japanese market (in their pre-video-games era), they obviously pronounced it the way it looked to them: セガ (seh gah), and since the Japanese created Sonic and a lot of their first party content, Americans would continue to say seh-gah, or say-gah.

 

Australia had a longer weaning period on to Sega, the Master System was waaayyyy more popular here than in the US, so we "grew up" without the pronunciation key given by the famous Mega Drive splash screen. Hence See-gah.

 

Funny story though... from actual former Sega OziSoft employees:

 

SEGA is short for Service Games, so they joked that maybe we should all be saying "Ser-gah"

[fliptopia 515]

1 hour ago, eveln said:

ummm, a wee play on the " sound" logic ...;) 

Very Low Jickle

[eveln 1,404]

2 hours ago, fliptopia said:

Very Low Jickle

Never heard of it before ... But if you mean a small low-brow uninspired party, then, I'm not sure, but I think I should be insulted ?! 

[@~thehung 961]

8 hours ago, eveln said:

I know. And it frustrates my logic that the vowel after the single g changes the pronunciation of the vowel before the g, but it does none of that with a gg  ... but there you have it. rules without, imo, sound logic

 

well, yes.  english is all kinds of fucked up.  you could say its mega-fucked up.  non-phonetic, with not nearly enough vowel symbols.  we have around 20 vowel sounds and only around 5 vowel characters.

 

its amazing how much our first language can effect what we hear too.  we tend to think that we hear objectively, but we dont.  vowels are made up of particular clusters of frequencies, each present in particular proportions at higher octaves.  but the pattern itself is like a signature.  it can be moved up or down in pitch, as long as the cluster is moved in unison and stays proportionately intact — which is why you can sing a low 'o' and a high 'o', and it never stops sounding like an 'o'. 

 

but what happens if someone speaking an exotic language makes a sound that contains most of the 'o' pattern along with some other frequencies?  then you have a situation like the classic optical illusion below.   if you had lived a life without any awareness of the existence of ducks, then you are simply never going to "see" the duck.  all the parts of it are right there in front of your face, and yet you cannot see it.  the best you could do is call it a weird looking rabbit.  because a rabbit is a rabbit is a rabbit, right?  but the vowel that person is using when they make their "weird 'o' " could be a very different animal.

 

 

even the slightest differences can be perceived differently.  French doesnt have our short 'i', so they often cant distinguish at all between Dominic and Dominique.  even with English speakers using different vowels for each 'i', and adding emphasis to the last syllable....cant hear it!

 

 

[fliptopia 515]

4 hours ago, eveln said:

Never heard of it before ... But if you mean a small low-brow uninspired party, then, I'm not sure, but I think I should be insulted ?! 

 

Low Jickle is how I thought logical might sound with an "oh" sound. 

[Cybes 1,433]

15 hours ago, eveln said:

it frustrates my logic that the vowel after the single g changes the pronunciation of the vowel before the g, but it does none of that with a gg

 

Think of the double character as the place to split syllables; if the character is single instead, the split leaves a trailing vowel which then sounds different.  (Not sure this always works, but it's as close to working as any rule gets in English)

 

5 hours ago, @~thehung said:

english is all kinds of fucked up.  you could say its mega-fucked up.  non-phonetic, with not nearly enough vowel symbols.  we have around 20 vowel sounds and only around 5 vowel characters.

 

It's a pidgin, not a real language.  Gauls, celts, Romans, Normans, Picts, Angles, and ghu-knows what else, all trying to trade with each other (at different times) - it's amazing any rules work at all.

 

"The problem with defending the purity of the English language is that English is about as pure as a cribhouse whore. We don’t just borrow words; on occasion, English has pursued other languages down alleyways to beat them unconscious and rifle their pockets for new vocabulary." - James D. Nicoll

[datafast69 95]

On 11/30/2019 at 5:14 PM, eveln said:

I voted A in both cases . And yes I can hear the difference.

 

Agreed!

 

Both B versions sound so wrong!

[eveln 1,404]

12 hours ago, fliptopia said:

 

Low Jickle is how I thought logical might sound with an "oh" sound. 

did you now ?   ... what surprised me was that jickle was an actual thang

[eveln 1,404]

8 hours ago, Cybes said:

"The problem with defending the purity of the English language is that English is about as pure as a cribhouse whore. We don’t just borrow words; on occasion, English has pursued other languages down alleyways to beat them unconscious and rifle their pockets for new vocabulary." - James D. Nicoll

I heartily concur. It's why I have absolutely no qualms about using " per say " instead of " per se"  ... I mean there is literally nothing to stop me !!

8 hours ago, datafast69 said:

Agreed!

 

Both B versions sound so wrong!

just not right to my ear   ... there's no wrong way is there ?!

[datafast69 95]

2 hours ago, eveln said:

I heartily concur. It's why I have absolutely no qualms about using " per say " instead of " per se"  ... I mean there is literally nothing to stop me !!

just not right to my ear   ... there's no wrong way is there ?!

Yes there is

 

If we don't make a stand folk might pronounce Sally as fru-belg-rimp!

[Cybes 1,433]

1 hour ago, datafast69 said:

pronounce Sally as fru-belg-rimp!

 

"Look, I'm just saying it's her name, ok - she can pronounce it any way she wants!"

[eveln 1,404]

4 hours ago, datafast69 said:

Yes there is

 

If we don't make a stand folk might pronounce Sally as fru-belg-rimp!

Folk sure might ... till Folk realises nobody talks to 'em