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Leonid

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2 minutes ago, eveln said:

So the loos available would be male, female, and unisex.

Unisex, with options for larger disabled/parent stalls.

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37 minutes ago, Nich... said:

Yes fucking please.


No thank you.

 

The biology’s different.

 

Women can’t use urinals. In unisex toilets there are no urinals which means men are using cubicles. Cubicles are great but they take longer, and women already queue to use them because of aforementioned biology - now they have to compete with males.

 

Some more interesting stuff on that:

1. Para 2.1.2 of SDG6 re applying UN Sustainable Goals states that separate gender specific toilets should always be provided to women

2. The United Nations Report on The Human Right to Safe Drinking Water and Sanitation states states that gender-specific toilets should be provided.

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5 minutes ago, Nich... said:

Unisex, with options for larger disabled/parent stalls.

so no male or female option ? just the unisex ?

reason I ask is that I'm not even comfortable using a public loo if the cleaning attendant is male , and insists on staying in the loos while I use it. If the male cleaner leaves it's all good

Edited by eveln

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Just now, eveln said:

so no male or female option ? just the unisex ?

Correct.
 

3 minutes ago, Leonid said:

Women can’t use urinals. In unisex toilets there are no urinals which means men are using cubicles. Cubicles are great but they take longer, and women already queue to use them because of aforementioned biology - now they have to compete with males.

 

Some more interesting stuff on that:

1. Para 2.1.2 of SDG6 re applying UN Sustainable Goals states that separate gender specific toilets should always be provided to women

2. The United Nations Report on The Human Right to Safe Drinking Water and Sanitation states states that gender-specific toilets should be provided.

a) look who suddenly cares what the UN says when it suits

b) who cares if there are no urinals.  You're no longer artificially splitting the pool of available toilets, and can load balance across all of them rather than a portion.
c) of the many outdoor concerts I've worked, they have trucked in lots of portable toilets.  They're almost always not a urinal - see b)

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1 minute ago, Nich... said:
4 minutes ago, eveln said:

so no male or female option ? just the unisex ?

Correct.

So I lose my option to a female only loo cos why ?  I'm not comfortable sharing public loos with males, sorry.

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6 minutes ago, fliptopia said:

You get the cubicle to yourself. Other than that you share a basin. 

Here's my reality on a daily basis ...

 I work in a place where the Ladies loos number about five in a row with a handicap one at one end and a mother's changing room for bubs and a loo also at the other.

 

All the loos are of course separated but anyone except the overly obese could crawl under or climb over any of the partitions if desired. It does my head in that male cleaners think they can stay in there whilst the femmes are wanting to have a pee etc.

 

Very few public loos are ceiling to floor enclosed, in my limited experience.  I'm sorry but I didn't grow up sharing one of my vulnerable  states with strangers, I was lucky like that.

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Well could you argue for better partitioning in that respect? I always thought it made more sense when you go to a theatre and women are lining up and the men's bathroom is nearly empty. 

 

But I get that not everyone is comfortable with the idea. I'd like to look at what might help making someone comfortable to find a solution that works for the most people rather than just assuming it can't be done. 

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3 minutes ago, fliptopia said:

Well could you argue for better partitioning in that respect?

Haha ohh yeah I probably could till I'm blue in the face . lol.

 

5 minutes ago, fliptopia said:

I'd like to look at what might help making someone comfortable to find a solution that works for the most people rather than just assuming it can't be done. 

Fully enclosed cubicles are a great idea, but then one has to leave that and face whatever at the basins 😛 ... seriously though comfort won't be the issue, costs will decide the way it goes, as per usual.

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27 minutes ago, eveln said:

Haha ohh yeah I probably could till I'm blue in the face . lol.

 

Fully enclosed cubicles are a great idea, but then one has to leave that and face whatever at the basins 😛 ... seriously though comfort won't be the issue, costs will decide the way it goes, as per usual.

 

Probably. But sometimes costs happen regardless. Just ask a pool owner about the cost of their fencing. 

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Yeah, you're arguing against unisex toilets by saying that the current layout of your toilets is subpar and therefore you want to keep them 🤷‍♀️

Every unisex toilet I've used and seen is fully enclosed like an actual household toilet, not some big person version of what you see in a primary school, where kids can't be trusted with that much privacy.  The best ones I've seen, they're in a single row, sometimes along both sides of the walkway to access them.  At each end are washbasins, and they usually have multiple entrances. 

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Just now, Nich... said:

look who suddenly cares what the UN says when it suits


Look who suddenly doesn’t.

 

Just now, Nich... said:

who cares if there are no urinals.


Women that are queuing while men are sitting on the John for a pee and punching the small screen for a chat on WhatsApp

1 hour ago, Nich... said:

of the many outdoor concerts I've worked, they have trucked in lots of portable toilets. 


I go to the Outdoor Cinema every summer.

they have at least 50 of the damned things.

 

Queues for 20mins.

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1 minute ago, Leonid said:

Women that are queuing while men are sitting on the John for a pee and punching the small screen for a chat on WhatsApp

Ah yes.  The mythical mens toilets that are urinals only with no space at all wasted on stalls.

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1 hour ago, Nich... said:

~  You're no longer artificially splitting the pool of available toilets, and can load balance across all of them rather than a portion.

 

 

Ehh-eh-eh-ehhh !!!

He said "load" !!!

 

 

 

hqdefault.jpg

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7 minutes ago, Nich... said:

Ah yes.  The mythical mens toilets that are urinals only with no space at all wasted on stalls.


The mythical unisex toilets where women don’t get the raw end of the deal in every single possible way.

 

Unisex toilets are to women’s sanitation what trans athletes are to women’s sport.

Edited by Leonid
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It’s the same story every single time. In much the same way as socialists impoverish the poor, social justice warriors permanently destroy indigenous cultures into welfare dependency, gender fluidity activists clearly hate women but lack the intellectual honesty of incels who can at least admit it.

 

Stop trying to create a world where obvious differences in requirements and optimisations for these are ignored in favour of an equality, biology has preordained to not exist.

 

Men and women - the only two genders, have different plumbing. Women MUST sit whereas men have choices depending on activity.

 

Anyone who’s been to a male toilet in a busy area is well acquainted with piss on seats which is largely impossible in a women’s toilet.

 

In unisex toilets you are FORCING women to deal with sanitation issues not of their gender for some fucked up ideological purpose.

 

Stop being utter cunts to women.

Edited by Leonid

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31 minutes ago, fliptopia said:

 

Probably. But sometimes costs happen regardless. Just ask a pool owner about the cost of their fencing. 

umm, okay then. ...  didn't realise pool owners had to worry about unisex shit wrt their  fencing 😛

 

28 minutes ago, Nich... said:

Yeah, you're arguing against unisex toilets by saying that the current layout of your toilets is subpar and therefore you want to keep them 🤷‍♀️

you're right. I am arguing from what my experience of them is.  Just as you're  too . See below.

Quote


Every unisex toilet I've used and seen is fully enclosed like an actual household toilet, not some big person version of what you see in a primary school, where kids can't be trusted with that much privacy.  The best ones I've seen, they're in a single row, sometimes along both sides of the walkway to access them.  At each end are washbasins, and they usually have multiple entrances. 

 

Edited by eveln

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22 minutes ago, Leonid said:

Women MUST sit whereas men have choices depending on activity.

Or squat. Sometimes I'll go into a cubicle that has footprints that show someone, as I suppose, squatting would entail

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I'm surprised the SJW brigade hasn't proposed squat dunnies on the basis that some cultures squat when they drop the Manly supporters off at the pool.

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3 minutes ago, eveln said:

Or squat. Sometimes I'll go into a cubicle that has footprints that show someone, as I suppose, squatting would entail

 

You still wouldn't wanna squat over a pissed-on toilet bowl, standing in pee on the floor due to some bloke not being able to aim his pecker for shit.

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Just now, Leonid said:

 

You still wouldn't wanna squat over a pissed-on toilet bowl, standing in pee on the floor due to some bloke not being able to aim his pecker for shit.

No, that would make me leave top find other loos. Let's be real though females and kids can be pretty foul too. For me, I am not comfortable being vulnerable around strange males. Strange females are bearable just 😛

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2 hours ago, Nich... said:

Every unisex toilet I've used and seen is fully enclosed like an actual household toilet, not some big person version of what you see in a primary school, where kids can't be trusted with that much privacy.  The best ones I've seen, they're in a single row, sometimes along both sides of the walkway to access them.  At each end are washbasins, and they usually have multiple entrances. 

 

yeah, multiple entry/exit points and doorless access to the outside is best.  anyone worried about their safety is far less likely to feel cornered, and they know if they ever need to call out the sound will carry far. 

larger cubicles that make it a way more comfortable experience to get out of a large winter coat and hang it or set down belongings away from the shitter.  and generous spacing between basins in the 'public' area of the bathroom.

these are all possible with the real estate saved by amalgamating.  but they wouldnt be appropriate or viable for every kind of venue and demographic though.

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8 minutes ago, @~thehung said:

these are all possible with the real estate saved by amalgamating.

 

You'll save no space:

1. Fully enclosed means a wall. These are by definition thicker than whatever those partitions are.

2. Urinals optimize time for those using them. This means more cubicles are required in the absence of urinals.

3. More cubicles means more space required.

4. Muslim men use bathrooms to wash their feet in the absence of prayer rooms (wudu). Much as I think it's vulgar - and much as I hate religion in general, the fact remains that they believe they cannot do this in the presence of women.

5. Given (4), there's going to be a need (because the same people who hate conservative Christians bend right over for conservative Muslims) to create a separate area at least for washrooms.

6. Women use the bathroom for social retreats away from men and to re-do makeup/adjust stuff, etc. That doesn't work when the part you need (the sink area) is a thoroughfare for men.

 

And achieve nothing:

Because you simply don't. Not one additional benefit is unlocked by eliminating male and female bathrooms.

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22 minutes ago, Leonid said:

 

You'll save no space:

1. Fully enclosed means a wall. These are by definition thicker than whatever those partitions are.

2. Urinals optimize time for those using them. This means more cubicles are required in the absence of urinals.

3. More cubicles means more space required.

4. Muslim men use bathrooms to wash their feet in the absence of prayer rooms (wudu). Much as I think it's vulgar - and much as I hate religion in general, the fact remains that they believe they cannot do this in the presence of women.

5. Given (4), there's going to be a need (because the same people who hate conservative Christians bend right over for conservative Muslims) to create a separate area at least for washrooms.

6. Women use the bathroom for social retreats away from men and to re-do makeup/adjust stuff, etc. That doesn't work when the part you need (the sink area) is a thoroughfare for men.

 

And achieve nothing:

Because you simply don't. Not one additional benefit is unlocked by eliminating male and female bathrooms.

 

1. it doesnt mean a thick load bearing wall.  theres lots of options and materials.

2,3. most people try not to shit in public toilets.  ergo, mens cubicles are often underutilised.  also, men take less time to pee than women. 

1,2,3. so no, it doesnt follow that you necessarily need more cubicles, nor that if you do you need more space.   theres economies of scale at play architecturally: a toaster that does 4 slices is not double the volume of one that does 2.  

1,2,3,4,5,6. as i said, they wouldnt be appropriate or viable for every kind of venue and demographic.

 

 

Edited by @~thehung
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1 hour ago, @~thehung said:

doesnt mean a thick load bearing wall.  theres lots of options and materials.

 

(i) a minimum clear width of 900mm between the walls of the bathroom if located in a separate room; and

(ii) a minimum 1200mm clear circulation space forward of the toilet pan exclusive of the swing of the door. 

 

At least point (ii) is a shitload bigger than ANY cubicle I've ever been in.

 

1 hour ago, @~thehung said:

most people try not to shit in public toilets. 

 

I really would love it if you could justify this statistic.

 

1 hour ago, @~thehung said:

also, men take less time to pee than women. 

 

On urinals. Yes. On toilets - depends.

Is a mobile phone and a riveting conversation on Atomic involved?

 

1 hour ago, @~thehung said:

so no, it doesnt follow that you necessarily need more cubicles, nor that if you do you need more space

 

It does follow that you absolutely need more cubicles and more space.

 

 

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